CO-OP Wish list/Fix list

[Dai-San]

Ok, we seem to be posting all over the place, a comment here, a problem fix there so I though I would start a single thread to try and pull us all together hopefully.

Before I start I just want to clarify just WHAT I'm hoping for here. This thread is aimed at MULTI-PLAYER CO-OP.

To qualify that I mean a group of players on one team playing against the AI in a mission based scenario.

Not DM - Players playing against Players.

Not TDM - A TEAM of Players playing against another TEAM of Players.

I have nothing against these gametypes, I just don't play em and would rather you set up your own thread covering that gametype so as not to confuse the issue here.

Right, first off the most important things from my POV are. (in no particular order)

1 - Co-op limit MUST be raised from 4

2 - Mission Editing tools (Or the whole thing is pointless)

3 - A DECENT set of Server options

4 - Dedicated Server files

5 - Option to scrap the Team leader dies = game over nonsense

6 - Option to skip the Insert animations

7 - IP to IP hosting option ala [GR]

8 - Ready indicator in the loadout screen (Why should I have to type I'm ready)

9 - Mission Brief (ala [GR]) I want at least some idea of what to take please

10 - Smoke Grenades (Though tbh I think this may be a bit awkward to script the AI)

I will no doubt add to these as I think of em (unless you lot get em up first) but please feel free to jump on in guy's and lets get GR:AW Co-op back to what it should be... FUN

[enven]

My main wishes are pretty minute...

Bring back the [GR] gameplay styles; more versatile gameplay = fun.

and release the sdk/mod tools to the public already...Why wait for a patch? Whats the big deal?

[Sheldon_AS]

Excellent, thank you Dai-San.

I would also like you to add other COOP game modes, FireFight, Defend.

(although I suppose those will come when we have a mission editing tool available to make them ourselves).

Edited May 8, 2006 by Sheldon_AS

[LT.INSTG8R]

Agree with all the above points. Cant think of anything else I believe its been covered

[Brainpr0n]

Yeah, I can't think of anything else to add either. (shrug)

If all the above is added, GRAW will be a contender for my new favorite game of all time.

[REC0N]

+ Smoke grenade.

(Dai-San please add the following suggestions to your list, so it will be pure easy for GRIN to keep up, because its a pain reading through hundreds of diffrent posts).

Edited May 8, 2006 by REC0N

[calius]

I bump due to the fact it hits the nail on the head from many threads and is specific to an MP area I like the most

Number 5 was a surefire thing to sort out realy, I read it in other posts and realy was ... " "

To add to number 5:

I mentioned having a mission option that if Team Leader does die you have to then gather rest of team, abort main mission objective and use your team the best way to get to emergency extraction point on the map (whever that gets spawned). Rather than it just ends. That way Team Leader gets to ponder on mistakes and sit it out & rest of team can rally to work out plan B and not spend the rest of the session blasting the Team Leader for getting shot or being sloppy! Plus you still have the concepts of team leader dying actualy still being a problem as you dont complete the mission becuase you had to "abort to extraction". This also helps to make sure you look after team leader but not to the point of treating him like pure gold! To me thats a trade off and a win-win for both GRINs team leader idea and what we want in terms of not an abrupt and unrealistic end to a coop mission.

As regards team mates if your online with only 1 or 2 others is the other team member not included or is it an AI bot you can waypoint? OR like [GR] team mates not a player can be set to be still available server side as AI. I think the option was "AI teammates" or something.

I dont have full game but could someone elaborate a bit more on number 3 not in terms of cups half empty but in terms of what would be nice for that.

[REC0N]

You should be able to lock the "thread and the friend indicator" plus the "auto-reload", so it cant be used on your server.

Edited May 8, 2006 by REC0N

[Enos Pork]

I sure agree with all above!

1 - Co-op limit MUST be raised from 4

Take us in by two helis as two squads with two commanders.

If you still want the "not so good" commander-dies-game-over then let team A join team B and vice versa.

Oh! one more thing: "Ghost cam" in Coop please!

[ActionJackson]

#3. Server options should include "Respawn #". This is the thing that causes most people to yawn and go watch TV.

[Buehgler_AS]

Dead on Dai-San!!

I believe that (unless they have done something really odd in the engine) we can solve the "Mitchel is dead" issues with scripting tools. We should also be able to incorporate the alternate mission goals type scenario that Calius described. We (Alpha Squad) had toyed with an idea sort of like this for SR2005, but decided against it at the time. In my opinion it is adding features like this along with a bit of randomness that can dramatically increase the replayability of missions.

I'll go back to crossing my fingers for the patch and the release of SDK/mod-tools that will make this all possible. It really would be a shame for such a nice looking game to be denied such tools and possabilities.

[calius]

Dead on Dai-San!!

I believe that (unless they have done something really odd in the engine) we can solve the "Mitchel is dead" issues with scripting tools. We should also be able to incorporate the alternate mission goals type scenario that Calius described. We (Alpha Squad) had toyed with an idea sort of like this for SR2005, but decided against it at the time. In my opinion it is adding features like this along with a bit of randomness that can dramatically increase the replayability of missions.

I'll go back to crossing my fingers for the patch and the release of SDK/mod-tools that will make this all possible. It really would be a shame for such a nice looking game to be denied such tools and possabilities.

Funny you say that mate, as it was AS type mission scripting that was the theme. Ive seen other mission scripts that have that dynamic type of change of plot. To play GRAW with its graphics and waypoint tactics and all its good stuff & then play as normal on AS servers or COOP servers in general then we have a long lasting game without question. Heres to crossed fingers.

[whc.demo]

i wish for Anti-Aliasing!! (no flaming this is a WISH list)

and the usual bug fixes etc everyone else has already mentioned

coop needs a respawn system and the abilty to choose the captain, not making the host go captain.

aaaand mp needs some better game types , domination is run and gun spam, feels like im playing something n00by like bf2 or quake 3.

[Dai-San]

i wish for Anti-Aliasing!! (no flaming this is a WISH list)

and the usual bug fixes etc everyone else has already mentioned

coop needs a respawn system and the abilty to choose the captain, not making the host go captain.

aaaand mp needs some better game types , domination is run and gun spam, feels like im playing something n00by like bf2 or quake 3.

This is not a flame my friend but please read the first post again.

This thread is trying to keep all the CO-OP issues together without it getting lost in numorous other wishes and fixes such as AA etc.

[Deosl]

You should be able to change ghost leader before start. The host is always ghost leader, should be optionable.

[buddhiraja73]

I agree with most of the points.

A few additions --

-- Future missions should be less scripted with less trigerring events. In the current ones, Y does not happen unless we do X and there is no other way out. The vehicles always come at the same time and stop at the same place etc.

-- Getting multiple mission objectives rather than one at a time.

-- I don't like the 'You are leaving the mission area' concept. I often want to take a much wider route rather than taking the enemies head on. In a nutshell, giving more freedom to the player.

-- Giving as many options as possible about everything. Different players have different tastes.

[PsyloSatan]

I know this is a huge request (and will most likely need both mod tools and the ability to add more players to co-op than 4) but when someone told me there were no doors I was crushed. I know it sounds simple, but to me at least doors were an extremely important part of GR1 co-op.

While anticipating GRAW I didnt even give them a second thought because I could not think of a single reason why they would not be there. I am the main grenadier for my co-op group and the lack of doors reduces my effective usefullness to my group signifigantly. Not only that, it makes it feel like alot of map space is rendered completely useless. Im not talking about making every door have the ability to be opened/closed but there should at least be a good number that are. The game is incomplete without them, especially in urban settings.

I read the bit about too many doors making the map an impossible maze too. Unfortunately Id have to say that while that may be the case, I dont think it is a reasonable excuse. Thats part of urban warfare if I understand correctly. And as far as gameplay goes the more map area that is accessible, the more fun I have. For a game targeting the elite GR community (lack of something similar to GR1 training mission for example) I really dont see navigational problems as something that would be a let-down...

[calius]

I know this is a huge request (and will most likely need both mod tools and the ability to add more players to co-op than 4) but when someone told me there were no doors I was crushed. I know it sounds simple, but to me at least doors were an extremely important part of GR1 co-op.

While anticipating GRAW I didnt even give them a second thought because I could not think of a single reason why they would not be there. I am the main grenadier for my co-op group and the lack of doors reduces my effective usefullness to my group signifigantly. Not only that, it makes it feel like alot of map space is rendered completely useless. Im not talking about making every door have the ability to be opened/closed but there should at least be a good number that are. The game is incomplete without them, especially in urban settings.

I read the bit about too many doors making the map an impossible maze too. Unfortunately Id have to say that while that may be the case, I dont think it is a reasonable excuse. Thats part of urban warfare if I understand correctly. And as far as gameplay goes the more map area that is accessible, the more fun I have. For a game targeting the elite GR community (lack of something similar to GR1 training mission for example) I really dont see navigational problems as something that would be a let-down...

Thats not to say this wont be available in map creation with tools though. Will have to see, but I cant see it being a complete non-option.

[REC0N]

Can we please make this topic a sticky before it disapears?.

[ruggbutt]

I'm not a coop player, but I'm gonna stand behind you guys and say to GRIN that I agree with what you guys want fixed.

I'd rather fight the good fight than just ignore a gametype that doesn't affect me personally. Others here could learn something.

[REC0N]

+ civilians, maybe also dogs cats and birds.

[Judge_Recluse]

The ability for anyone to mark waypoints or enemies via the cross comm. This would make it easier because the leader is usually not the Point Man.

[RLCSeMPeRFi]

a Co-op mode where you know all your mission objectives before the mission begins with NO mission boundaries to stop your team from taking any way they want to engage the objectives. Basically non-linear, because right now its pretty darn linear to me.

NO team leader. Dedicated server options. The round ends when everyone is dead or mission complete.

The least they can do is match the stupid console in weapons and options. This is the PC version ######. Put in all or more of the co-op and MP modes and weapons from the 360. With the same amount or more server options PLEASE.

Edited May 10, 2006 by RLCSeMPeRFi

[SimDooD]

Not being able to select leader to anyone other than the host is just wrong. What was wrong with the original voting system in GR? It was perfect for planning deployment chain-of-command setup in the event that the leader went down, prior to insert. I can't recall any teams who didn't clearly establish their chain-of-command via the voting system prior to insert in the SR2005 (and previous) tourneys. If they didn't use the voting system, it was usually done over TS with bribes of pizza and beer and not delineated by who ran the server (urk!)

As for doors and the like, it sounds like the engine has maximised the playable area at the expense of functionality within that area. i.e smaller map, more features. Hopefully the mod kit will allow us to make/test the balancing of the two "in-game" for best results. Some smaller maps in GR1 were fantastic because they were so intricate, whilst bigger playfields didn't require fancy networks within them.

4 man Co-Op? Come on guys.... let's get it right... 9 man minimum!

Ultimately, as the mission leader, what I need to see before launching a Co-Op mission is this....

1) clearly defined and configurable chain-of-command structure (vote style is cool)

2) loadout of each team member to ensure it meets my requirements of leader. I don't want to have to keep asking what each team member is packing, I want to see it visually

3) pre-planning map to set initial waypoints for each squad

4) a big, fat, green "GO" button

[V.P.]

Good points people, I however only have one real coop-specific request:

You should be able to change the ghost leader before mission start. The host is always ghost leader, should be optionable.