Second MP Outing

[Pritzl]

After finishing the campaign for the second time, I got online and after a frustrating 10+ minutes trying to find a compatible game, I finally joined a "Team Deathmatch" game where I had to download the map (another 5 minutes) and restart the game. (5 more) Naturally, I had forgotten the name of the server and I had to go through the search all over again.

Finally, 30 minutes later, I joined the game. First mission, still slightly overwhelmed, I get booted into the game without having the opportunity to equip myself. What a really lame feature. What's the point? Let me stay at the arming screen all day long if I want to.

Thankfully, the game ended before anything happened. I choose a simple loadout, SCAR-H + combatsight and smoke grenades and get ready to have fun. WRONG! I got sniped, and sniped, and sniped, and sniped again. Once, I even think I got strangled by an opponent! Yes, I was that bad! I only managed one kill over the next 30 or so minutes but managed to die at least a dozen times.

Don't get me wrong, I expected to be massacared, afterall, I'm a total noob wrt online FPS games, tactical or otherwise. No, what concerned me was the following:

• I only had an hour to spare so the 30 minutes spent trying to just find a server I could join was rather frustrating. There are just not enough populated servers and the frequency of mismatched files is irritating. Is there some sort of "standard" set of files I'm missing or something?
  
• People seem to have memorized the maps so well, I only saw my killer on two occassions. The rest of the time I went from standing to face down in the dirt without seeing or hearing a peep. Wouldn't have bothered me too much except that with a 7 minute map rotation I never had the time to even begin to figure out the map myself. Are such short durations the norm?
  
• I was never sure whether or not I was making a racket. e.g. is it dependent on what I hear locally? Because at my end the only "silent" movement is the crouched run which doesn't make much sense. I would have expected a crouched walk would be more silent but it actually sounds much louder on my PC.
  
• Team-mates seemed to run away from me more often than not. I know you probably don't specifically wish for a noob on your tail, but surely it's better than being completely alone, no? Is joining a squad the only way to have fun? I hope not, because I really don't have the time for that. This is not Deathmatch-specific, even in [GR] coops (my first outing) there seemed to be little communication between team-mates in-game. I suppose some were on TeamSpeak though.
  

I guess what I was hoping for was a noob-friendly environment where 'tards like myself can get the hang of things before being gang-raped by the rest of you.

[Cangaroo.TNT]

Forgive me if you already know any of this.

I only had an hour to spare so the 30 minutes spent trying to just find a server I could join was rather frustrating. There are just not enough populated servers and the frequency of mismatched files is irritating. Is there some sort of "standard" set of files I'm missing or something?

Here's what I do: When I'm, in the lobby and I see a server hosting a map I don't have, I click "join" just so I can download the map. I do that on any server I see with a new map. After the map is downloaded, I go to another server so I don't have to restart the game. That way, the map will be available next time I start the game.

People seem to have memorized the maps so well, I only saw my killer on two occassions. The rest of the time I went from standing to face down in the dirt without seeing or hearing a peep. Wouldn't have bothered me too much except that with a 7 minute map rotation I never had the time to even begin to figure out the map myself. Are such short durations the norm?

What I love about this game is that although there are good spots on each map, no one can hide in any of them for very long. With muzzle flash & tracers giving away your position, it's only a matter of time before you're spotted. You have to get 1 or 2 kills and then MOVE! Yes, short map durations are the norm.

I was never sure whether or not I was making a racket. e.g. is it dependent on what I hear locally? Because at my end the only "silent" movement is the crouched run which doesn't make much sense. I would have expected a crouched walk would be more silent but it actually sounds much louder on my PC.

Someone (I think Grin Desmond) explained the movement sounds, and it made perfect sense. I wish I could point you to the thread, but I can't.

Team-mates seemed to run away from me more often than not. I know you probably don't specifically wish for a noob on your tail, but surely it's better than being completely alone, no? Is joining a squad the only way to have fun? I hope not, because I really don't have the time for that. This is not Deathmatch-specific, even in [GR] coops (my first outing) there seemed to be little communication between team-mates in-game. I suppose some were on TeamSpeak though.

I depends LOL. Try joining a server with public TeamSpeak (BDA & AFZ are only 2 of the many). Also, it depends on the game type. I think you're more likely to get spontaneous teamwork when playing Domination. Edited December 21, 2006 by Cangaroo[TNT]

[sui317]

if you find a server put it in favorite list

do your own thing, or follow some one and try to cover his back

remember his name, because if you see that he has been killed you are sure to be next in line

go the silent route, walk where there is no gun fire, listen to the sounds

explore the maps and don't get frustrated, walk slow and try to keep cover in arms reach

if confident... go towards the fire, be ready to shoot

try to follow the tracers, they give a good indication of where someone might be

at all times, LISTEN and keep an eye on he mini map. don't rush forward

in the beginning, cause most spawn points have bottle necks and snipers and rushers will go for those crucial points

keep in the dark, only cross the street running and hug the walls and corners

once you know the maps and you feel confident you will be more in the game and less in the lobby

when you know the maps you will understand others when you see them moving one way or the other

as a happy camper i would suggest going for higher ground, not to become a fellow camper cause i love my regular spots but it also gives relative security and peace to explore the layout

and often shows you how people move and what the paths are most often used.... these are most likely the ones with most cover

but if you become a camper like me.... pitch up a tent any time and enjoy the view

sometimes it is better not to kill or shoot, but wait untill you know the opponent does not expect that angle

often people run away from spawn and niglect some vital corners

once you know some good spots you can see them run and get them when they do not expect it (in the back)

as for team play...

i never used TS, but i learned to read the game and movements

sometimes you find that someone follows you or that you bumb in to a team mate and walk up together and you spontaniously give cover

i can only imagine what a TS game would be like

as a camper i sometimes find that i can give hints, to team mates

and chat things like" in the tower" or "sniper"

those are vague but those who are with you or close to you often pick these hints up and use them to their advantage

i often read hints like " below you sui" or "down to the left"

sometimes games are hectic and you see people type " HELP"

(seen it once or twice..) but those times i did see people move towards that team mate and give the help that was asked for

so even without TS you can communicate quick and it works

but most of all, start slow and low... and learn to read the game

communicate even if it is just a simple hello in the beginning and

a praise to the sniper who shot you... with any luck he/she will answere

and give you a clue what you did wrong, and if it is just a thanks

that you get in return, it did open communication for future moments

good luck

*this is my own experiance and not a "how to" so if this gets you killed even quicker and more often, sorry for the bad advise*

[Ghost9]

There aren't very many populated servers so you're limited to a few. I'd add the populated ones to your favorites for easy searching.

As far as mismatched files, you'll want to make sure that you have the most up to date patch.

http://www.fileshack.com/file.x/9201/Ghost...hter+1.35+Patch

Gameplay tends to be a lot different in MP. Much faster. Since lag is an issue often times it's smart to move fast than play it safe peeking corners. Standing still almost always gets you shot. stick and move, stick and move.

The maps aren't hard to learn. Give it some more time and you'll have it down.

Sound is a huge deal in this game. sounds gives away positions very easily and yes the quitest way to move around is the crouch run. Crouch walk is basically dragging your knees on the ground and makes the greatest amount of noise. lots of people make that mistake though.

Teamwork is rare unless on teamspeak and even then barely ever. My biggest gripe about this game is the complete lack of in game comms. For a game that is supposed to be teambased and tactical, what sense does it mean to have no means to communicate with your team?!?! so unfortunately unless you find a server using ts that people are playing on, you'll be out of luck. The beer drinking assassins server usually has a good amount of people using TS so i'd recommend that. they do have some custom maps you'd need to download though.

[Pritzl]

Appreciate the tips. Some followups:

@Ghost9, I do have the latest patch installed, and always rename my "local/english" folder with all my mods before starting a MP session. I still regularly get the mismatched files error on over 50% of the servers though. Which makes me think that those servers are using some mods beyond the stock stuff. Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be a way to figure out which mods they are using. How far off am I?

Wrt crouch-walk. I can understand the knee-dragging when side-stepping, but it makes a lot less sense when just moving forwards or backwards.

@Sui, I thought of camping, but without even the faintest grasp of the map, I don't even know where to start looking for a good spot. Maybe if I had more than the 1 hour on hand I could have explored more. The biggest hurdle is the map duration though.

I have also yet to see tracer/muzzle flash except up close and personal when it's usually too late as I'm the one getting shot at and shortly dead.

@Cangaroo. That's what is probably killing me; I tend to move when I should stay put and vice versa. Again, too unfamiliar with the maps atm. Perhaps it's worthwhile to explore them offline?

Oh and thanks for the server recommendations. I assume the TS ips are available on the server info tab or something?

[Cangaroo.TNT]

Oh and thanks for the server recommendations. I assume the TS ips are available on the server info tab or something?

You're welcome, and your assumption is correct. And, as a courtesy, you should refrain from killing anyone that helped you in this thread

[Pritzl]

' date='Dec 21 2006, 03:35 PM' post='441125']

Oh and thanks for the server recommendations. I assume the TS ips are available on the server info tab or something?

You're welcome, and your assumption is correct. And, as a courtesy, you should refrain from killing anyone that helped you in this thread

Like I could! I'd have to stop getting spawn-raped first.

[Zero Gulf]

Pritzl

Another good tip is, get TS, then when in a game you may find other newer players like yourself. Make arrangements to play a game with just 2 or 4 new players. That way you can mutually agree to go into a DM or TvT match and not fire at each other, just explore the map and learn tactics/strategy. When ready the 2/4 of you can practice without getting raped by more experienced players.

After a short while you will find that you can hold your own, or even be a true threat Online!

All wil honor you with "Hail Pritzl! PRITZL THE MAP MASTER! " (Cheers go up from the grubby throng!)

Edited December 21, 2006 by Zero Gulf

[Ghost9]

Perhaps it's worthwhile to explore them offline?

you could always start your own server, which people probably won't join or can't due to firewalls etc, and run around on all the mp maps. That would let you explore without getting shot. I dunno how else you can do it offline.

[sui317]

you can host a lan game, set all players ready or server ready and you can do a walk through

Edited December 21, 2006 by sui317

[Pritzl]

you can host a lan game, set all players ready or server ready and you can do a walk through

Yeah, that's what I meant.

Interesting concept Zero Gulf. Maybe if all else fails.

Still having a problem though with BDA and AFZ servers. Both tell me I have a file mismatch but I can't figure out what mods, if any, are installed. I tried browsing the AFZ forums and found nothing there or in their downloads section. The BDA site is offline too. The only server I have managed to successfully join was the Shadow 'something or other' elite server and there was a whole bunch of spawn-raping going on there. Wouldn't mind as much if I wasn't such a noob that it really is overkill. I could be at your spawn point and you could still kill me. e.g. I spawned in once and saw a couple of guys running toward our spawn area so I took up a position and one of them obliged and ran right by my sights. I emptied an entire SCAR-L clip into him and he still managed to kill me!

I did get one spawn-raper though. Purely by accident, I spawned facing him as he was firing (in zoomed mode I presume at someone off to my right. Emptied my entire clip into him even after he was lifeless on the ground. Felt good... for about 10 seconds until his fellow spawn-raper got me back.

PS: The funniest part is that there is an "official" UBI server, but it's running 1.30. Someone forget to update it?

Edited December 22, 2006 by Pritzl

[ROCO*AFZ*]

you can host a lan game, set all players ready or server ready and you can do a walk through

Yeah, that's what I meant.

Interesting concept Zero Gulf. Maybe if all else fails.

Still having a problem though with BDA and AFZ servers. Both tell me I have a file mismatch but I can't figure out what mods, if any, are installed. I tried browsing the AFZ forums and found nothing there or in their downloads section. The BDA site is offline too. The only server I have managed to successfully join was the Shadow 'something or other' elite server and there was a whole bunch of spawn-raping going on there. Wouldn't mind as much if I wasn't such a noob that it really is overkill. I could be at your spawn point and you could still kill me. e.g. I spawned in once and saw a couple of guys running toward our spawn area so I took up a position and one of them obliged and ran right by my sights. I emptied an entire SCAR-L clip into him and he still managed to kill me!

I did get one spawn-raper though. Purely by accident, I spawned facing him as he was firing (in zoomed mode I presume at someone off to my right. Emptied my entire clip into him even after he was lifeless on the ground. Felt good... for about 10 seconds until his fellow spawn-raper got me back.

PS: The funniest part is that there is an "official" UBI server, but it's running 1.30. Someone forget to update it?

The only mod's on our server (AFZ... aka AttackforceZ[TDM1.35]) is a few co-op maps which we rarely have up. All TDM is stock and i haven't heard of anyone having a problem joining.

Is it possible that you were joining during a map change... if so it will say Connecting...

and never goes any further. If that is the case wait like 10 seconds and try it again.

Most TDM servers allow spawn raping as it's not restricted in matching. We do... but there is a catch. On spawn you are invincible for 6-7 seconds (it's a server setting so other servers may not set this)so use it to clear out the annoying rapers.

What patch is installed (when at the menu look near the bottom) If it doesn't say 1.35 the patch didn't take hold or you don't have the latest.

TS does help also and joining a team that has multiple clanmates as they will work as a team and help clear out the spawn.

Ours can be joined through our website.

Hope this gives you some incite.

[FI_FlimFlam]

If you are having problems with mismatch content - try moving or renaming your custom maps folder as a test. If you continue to have issues, you most likely have a mod installed that you have forgotten about or have a corrupt file that doesn't match the OTB (Out of The Box) install + patch files. Any server running the AC will boot you for mismatched content and this is probably the cause.

At that point I would uninstall GRAW and re-install and see if that fixed the issue.

As for the other gameplay issues... well not much I can say, besides keep trying to find servers you like. Generally, BDA and AFZ are good servers to play on once you get used to the rules they have. You will find each server is administrated differently with slightly different rules of behavior. Once you find one you like make sure to add it to your favorites.

The MP learning curve is pretty steep. Sounds are critical, and some players with better sound cards have reported to being able to hear people move sometimes nearly halfway across the map. So absolute stealth is pretty much not going to happen in this game. I can hear people shuffling or just inching forward while crouched if they are near.

Getting used to the player movement and weapon handling in MP is also hard to do when you come from the forgiving nature of the SP tango's AI. Being in tune with your speed with which you raise your weapon, you sprint, slide etc. are all of greater importance in MP. This will take some time to get up to speed so to say.

Then there is the lag factor. Definitely LPB's have an advantage. Usually the person with a lower ping in a one one encounter wins IMO. I generally find this to be true when both people round a corner at each other. So you will find some situations where you think you have the drop on someone only to die first and then hear the shots in a one one encounter. Kind of frustrating but all part of the experience.

As far as spawn camping/raping. HH and Siege are the worst game types for it IMO. Several of the stock maps are so small that you can sit in the smoke/zone and lob GL's or snipe or fire into the other team's spawn. This does nothing for the gameplay and why I tend to stay away from Siege or HH servers running stock maps for that reason. It just encourages it by making it so easy to do. Domination and TDM are better for the fact that they have larger maps and it is a bit harder for a team to spawn camp - but not impossible. Still it doesn't happen nearly as with the smaller Siege and HH maps.

If you want to try to join a [GR] coop server, check out ours. We do have the AC running currently to prevent people using UBER weapons (I believe the OGN weaps mod is one of them). But unfortunately it also keeps out people with cosmetic mods like the blood mod. Look for the Fatality Incorporated server. If you would like help testing the the the modified content issue I'll be happy to work with you and turn off the AC to see if you can just join.

Edited December 22, 2006 by FI_FlimFlam

[Pritzl]

The only mod's on our server (AFZ... aka AttackforceZ[TDM1.35]) is a few co-op maps which we rarely have up. All TDM is stock and i haven't heard of anyone having a problem joining.

Is it possible that you were joining during a map change... if so it will say Connecting...

and never goes any further. If that is the case wait like 10 seconds and try it again.

It was definitely a "file mismatch" error and it was persistent inspite of several attempts to join. Would the maps prompt the "file mismatch" error? I thought they only prompted you to download them if you didn't have them installed already.

What patch is installed (when at the menu look near the bottom) If it doesn't say 1.35 the patch didn't take hold or you don't have the latest.

I'm pretty sure it's 1.35, and it's a clean reinstall + 1.35 patch applied directly. I'll check though. And, thanks, I'll keep plugging at it and hopefully find the culprit.

If you are having problems with mismatch content - try moving or renaming your custom maps folder as a test. If you continue to have issues, you most likely have a mod installed that you have forgotten about or have a corrupt file that doesn't match the OTB (Out of The Box) install + patch files. Any server running the AC will boot you for mismatched content and this is probably the cause.

All my mods are in the "local/english" folder which I dutifully rename to "local/xenglish" to disable all my mods before going online. Besides, wouldn't I have trouble joining pretty much any game if it was a true mismatch? Keep in mind few of my mods are stock apart from SnowFella's M4. All the rest are personal tweaks that would mismatch with pretty much every server if they were still active. Unless of course their anticheats were turned off?

At that point I would uninstall GRAW and re-install and see if that fixed the issue.

Again? Worth a try I guess if all else fails.

Then there is the lag factor. Definitely LPB's have an advantage. Usually the person with a lower ping in a one one encounter wins IMO.

That would explain quite a few incidents. In one, it seemed like the guy who shot me did so right through the corner wall. Then again, the reason is obvious in retrospect, I was downloading a preview video at the same time!

As for the other gameplay issues... well not much I can say, besides keep trying to find servers you like. Generally, BDA and AFZ are good servers to play on once you get used to the rules they have. You will find each server is administrated differently with slightly different rules of behavior. Once you find one you like make sure to add it to your favorites.

Yep. All too familiar with how each server can have a completely different flavour from IL-2 and Jane's F/A-18 before that. However, until I figure out the cause of the "file mismatch" I'm kind of limited in my choices; sometimes to as few as 2 or 3 servers out of the entire list!

[spawn-raping] doesn't happen nearly as with the smaller Siege and HH maps.

That reminds me, what exactly do Siege and HH modes entail? I told you I was a total noob when it comes to FPS games.

If you want to try to join a [GR] coop server, check out ours. We do have the AC running currently to prevent people using UBER weapons (I believe the OGN weaps mod is one of them). But unfortunately it also keeps out people with cosmetic mods like the blood mod. Look for the Fatality Incorporated server. If you would like help testing the the the modified content issue I'll be happy to work with you and turn off the AC to see if you can just join.

Cheers and thanks for the invite. I'll take you up on your troubleshooting offer if I get stumped.

[ROCO*AFZ*]

The only mod's on our server (AFZ... aka AttackforceZ[TDM1.35]) is a few co-op maps which we rarely have up. All TDM is stock and i haven't heard of anyone having a problem joining.

Is it possible that you were joining during a map change... if so it will say Connecting...

and never goes any further. If that is the case wait like 10 seconds and try it again.

It was definitely a "file mismatch" error and it was persistent inspite of several attempts to join. Would the maps prompt the "file mismatch" error? I thought they only prompted you to download them if you didn't have them installed already.

What patch is installed (when at the menu look near the bottom) If it doesn't say 1.35 the patch didn't take hold or you don't have the latest.

I'm pretty sure it's 1.35, and it's a clean reinstall + 1.35 patch applied directly. I'll check though. And, thanks, I'll keep plugging at it and hopefully find the culprit.

If you are having problems with mismatch content - try moving or renaming your custom maps folder as a test. If you continue to have issues, you most likely have a mod installed that you have forgotten about or have a corrupt file that doesn't match the OTB (Out of The Box) install + patch files. Any server running the AC will boot you for mismatched content and this is probably the cause.

All my mods are in the "local/english" folder which I dutifully rename to "local/xenglish" to disable all my mods before going online. Besides, wouldn't I have trouble joining pretty much any game if it was a true mismatch? Keep in mind few of my mods are stock apart from SnowFella's M4. All the rest are personal tweaks that would mismatch with pretty much every server if they were still active. Unless of course their anticheats were turned off?

At that point I would uninstall GRAW and re-install and see if that fixed the issue.

Again? Worth a try I guess if all else fails.

Then there is the lag factor. Definitely LPB's have an advantage. Usually the person with a lower ping in a one one encounter wins IMO.

That would explain quite a few incidents. In one, it seemed like the guy who shot me did so right through the corner wall. Then again, the reason is obvious in retrospect, I was downloading a preview video at the same time!

As for the other gameplay issues... well not much I can say, besides keep trying to find servers you like. Generally, BDA and AFZ are good servers to play on once you get used to the rules they have. You will find each server is administrated differently with slightly different rules of behavior. Once you find one you like make sure to add it to your favorites.

Yep. All too familiar with how each server can have a completely different flavour from IL-2 and Jane's F/A-18 before that. However, until I figure out the cause of the "file mismatch" I'm kind of limited in my choices; sometimes to as few as 2 or 3 servers out of the entire list!

[spawn-raping] doesn't happen nearly as with the smaller Siege and HH maps.

That reminds me, what exactly do Siege and HH modes entail? I told you I was a total noob when it comes to FPS games.

If you want to try to join a [GR] coop server, check out ours. We do have the AC running currently to prevent people using UBER weapons (I believe the OGN weaps mod is one of them). But unfortunately it also keeps out people with cosmetic mods like the blood mod. Look for the Fatality Incorporated server. If you would like help testing the the the modified content issue I'll be happy to work with you and turn off the AC to see if you can just join.

Cheers and thanks for the invite. I'll take you up on your troubleshooting offer if I get stumped.

File mismatch is a mod. Snowfella's would fail out on our server as we run the anticheat. Some servers may not.

Try it with a clean non modded install... (later tonight as we are upgrading our server to an SATA drive over ide currently)

[FI_FlimFlam]

Cheers and thanks for the invite. I'll take you up on your troubleshooting offer if I get stumped.

No problem. Just shoot me a PM or look me up on our website: www.fatalityincorporated.com. We'll jump on TeamSpeak and try to get it sorted for you.

[Pritzl]

File mismatch is a mod. Snowfella's would fail out on our server as we run the anticheat. Some servers may not.

Try it with a clean non modded install... (later tonight as we are upgrading our server to an SATA drive over ide currently)

Oh I know. Like i said though, I disabled all my mods before going online by renaming my mods folder so the game wouldn't find and use it. I wonder if I have to put in an empty "english" directory too though?