SP maps ----> MP maps :-)

[Peace]

I'm not a SP player (I've only played 3 missions) but what I've seen there are many beautiful maps that could serve at least as official TDM maps.

In [GR] all SP maps were available for TDM (called LMS), HH, Siege, and Coop. That was one of the many strengths with [GR], and I cannot see any good reason not to carry on the same good tradition in GRAW. It would require minimal time and effort as the maps already exist!.

Please, UBI, GRiN with Bo & Co consider to make the SP maps available at least for MP TDM. That would greatly increase the interest in GRAW for those laddering clans and fungame players, who principally rely on official maps.

[DeathDealer71]

I'm not a SP player (I've only played 3 missions) but what I've seen there are many beautiful maps that could serve at least as official TDM maps.

In [GR] all SP maps were available for TDM (called LMS), HH, Siege, and Coop. That was one of the many strengths with [GR], and I cannot see any good reason not to carry on the same good tradition in GRAW. It would require minimal time and effort as the maps already exist!.

Please, UBI, GRiN with Bo & Co consider to make the SP maps available at least for MP TDM. That would greatly increase the interest in GRAW for those laddering clans and fungame players, who principally rely on official maps.

I agree it would be nice..

[Hockeystick]

Yeah the embassy in VIP 2 is down! would be a great MP map.

[Fripounet]

I agree. I don't like the symetrical (or almost symetrical) MP maps.

In GRAW, SP maps are big. They could be splitted in multiple smaller maps or offer the option to have random spawn for diversity and surprises.

An example of very good MP map is the first SP map of GR1 with the spawns at different altitudes.

[Silentwolf]

but hasn;t GRIN already stated that GRAW is ONE big map, Mexico, and as such, you could just take ANY chunk of it to make a map that you wanted for MP / Co-Op purposes

edit: so i guess all that would be needed is for GRIN to "release" the full map, maybe as an optional download for all the modders, to "cut up" as they please

Edited August 30, 2006 by Silentwolf

[Peace]

but hasn;t GRIN already stated that GRAW is ONE big map, Mexico, and as such, you could just take ANY chunk of it to make a map that you wanted for MP / Co-Op purposes

edit: so i guess all that would be needed is for GRIN to "release" the full map, maybe as an optional download for all the modders, to "cut up" as they please

NO Silentwolf, what I'm saying is that the laddering community needs officially released maps.

Custom maps by various modders and map makers are simply not feasible for competetive laddering. It normally creates far too much problem by it's various versions, downloads and stability issues.

I do not simply see the reason why not the SP maps are released for MP? ...[GR] had it (all SP maps were also avaliable in MP). It's just a waste of maps not doing so

GRiN can make the decision of 'how to cut the large one' (if now that is the case?)

The time and effort to release them would be insignificant compared with the time making them...

[viiiper]

but hasn;t GRIN already stated that GRAW is ONE big map, Mexico, and as such, you could just take ANY chunk of it to make a map that you wanted for MP / Co-Op purposes

edit: so i guess all that would be needed is for GRIN to "release" the full map, maybe as an optional download for all the modders, to "cut up" as they please

NO Silentwolf, what I'm saying is that the laddering community needs officially released maps.

Custom maps by various modders and map makers are simply not feasible for competetive laddering. It normally creates far too much problem by it's various versions, downloads and stability issues.

I do not simply see the reason why not the SP maps are released for MP? ...[GR] had it (all SP maps were also avaliable in MP). It's just a waste of maps not doing so

GRiN can make the decision of 'how to cut the large one' (if now that is the case?)

The time and effort to release them would be insignificant compared with the time making them...

The maps you refer too are already there to convert from SP > MP but if clans don't use them what is the point. The only difference with Grin releasing the MAP officially and a Modder doing it, is Grin will be Paid for it and the modder NOT.

I already extracted all the mission maps from 01 to 12 SP as probably other modders have done, but these maps are Grins ideas and work and I for one would not like to infringe there hard work.

Using Custom maps for laddering is not such a big deal, a tried and tested custom map is no different to the ones Grin makes, infact Grin still make basic bugs [com station grass] just like customs do..... The question is always, if it's tactfully playable and stable then why not use it ?

Versions

You point on versions does not stand, if a map is used for laddering and it's ie. v1.0 and a second adaptation came out ie. v1.2 the ladder would still use v1.0 trying to load a v1.2 map when the server is running v1.0 will result in un matched files.

Downloads

Simply have a central download repository of maps like here at GRnet, where all players can download the laddering map. There is no mystery in this idea and everyone would have access.

Stability

As mentioned above, Grins maps are not perfect either and only gain credibility by constant play, they have bug issues too, or have you not noticed ie. AVENUES ?

At the end of the day, I would think Grin will NOT be releasing the SP maps as MP unless Ubi pays them or it was part of the original contract.

viii

[Peace]

The maps you refer too are already there to convert from SP > MP but if clans don't use them what is the point. The only difference with Grin releasing the MAP officially and a Modder doing it, is Grin will be Paid for it and the modder NOT.

I already extracted all the mission maps from 01 to 12 SP as probably other modders have done, but these maps are Grins ideas and work and I for one would not like to infringe there hard work.

Using Custom maps for laddering is not such a big deal, a tried and tested custom map is no different to the ones Grin makes, infact Grin still make basic bugs [com station grass] just like customs do..... The question is always, if it's tactfully playable and stable then why not use it ?

Versions

You point on versions does not stand, if a map is used for laddering and it's ie. v1.0 and a second adaptation came out ie. v1.2 the ladder would still use v1.0 trying to load a v1.2 map when the server is running v1.0 will result in un matched files.

Downloads

Simply have a central download repository of maps like here at GRnet, where all players can download the laddering map. There is no mystery in this idea and everyone would have access.

Stability

As mentioned above, Grins maps are not perfect either and only gain credibility by constant play, they have bug issues too, or have you not noticed ie. AVENUES ?

At the end of the day, I would think Grin will NOT be releasing the SP maps as MP unless Ubi pays them or it was part of the original contract.

viii

Lol I knew pretty much this was going to come from you...Look Viiper we all know that you are a fan of map making and take your stand accordingly (and we accept that).

You should accept too, the fact that competitive gamers and admins clearly prefer official maps beacuse it i so much simplier. We do not extract, test out, make or create custom maps, there is little chance to see a ladder admin doing that (even if I wouldn't mind see that happening personally). For [GR] there was never any custom maps in use by the major ladders as TCZ, Clanbase etc, only official maps.

And if you so strongly believe it is as simple with custom maps as officially released maps... Look at what is happening at BDA's server. I think it's a little naive thinking that custom maps doesn't cause problems for users. A lot of players are already tired of all conflicts caused by the various map versions and error messages.

I still find it bothering that UBI/GRiN severely limits the potential of GRAW as a laddering game and breaking the tradition from [GR] to make all maps avaliable for MP

I surely would like to know the reason...

[viiiper]

....if you so strongly believe it is so simple with custom maps, Look at what is happening at BDA's server. It's just naive of you thinking that custom maps doesn't cause problems for users. Players are already tired of all conflicts caused by the various map versions and error messages.

What is happening at the BDA server is something totally different, it is not a

Laddering server... It's a fun server, a tactical community and it's early days,

they like many other servers are looking for the best combination and it's GRAW

that is making life difficult.

The only route you are looking for is the easy way out, I think others would disagree,

all there has to be in the future is a facility in GRAW (like many other games) to download

maps that are not on the client via a feature in the game, this may come or may not.

If it does come will you hold the same view? I know what you are saying, it's a mess to

download at the moment.

I am anything but naive on the subject and I do know Admins and comp. gamers prefer

built in map packs, I am telling you, Grin will NOT RELEASE THE SP maps for LADDERING PLEASURE unless it was part of the original contract (which I doubt) or Ubi will pay them to do so..... Wishful thinking or what !

You are hoping Grin will make a load of maps, and I think they might !!

in EXPANSION PACK 1 and not before in reference to ie. the SP/MP maps, the only maps your going to see are those in this 3rd patch and that’s it, so if your going to ladder then get practicing on the ones you have. It's commitment from those in modding like

DiGiTALY -TC-, the mappers and this community that keeps this alive and nothing from the ladder at this moment!

viii

p.s. The tone of this post is calm & objective, not angry & this is a forum, so what did you expect when you put up a load of poor excuses for the ladder community.....

p.p.s. Good luck with your laddering.

[ROCO*AFZ*]

Here is the bottom line...

Ladders only use official map packs unless it's a sanctioned tournament using a specific mod like Frostbite tourn in GR1

Individual custom maps are good for laddering as there are way to may versions and whoeever's team created the map could (not saying you would) insert hidden areas and such that no one would know about (like a transparent wall or something) except there team.

AFZ is all about laddering and tournaments for MP, although we will now and then play a made map for fun.

What Peace is saying is...

That the sp campaigns have many GREAT area's that would be GREAT in MP for laddering and such if GRin were to release them as individual TDM, DOM, HH, and such maps to increase the total amount of stock maps.

He also thinks that it would be an easier task for them then starting from the Ground up.

This is nothing against the map making skills and custom maps anyone makes but it is something teams that Ladder wouldn't mind seeing.

Versions

You point on versions does not stand, if a map is used for laddering and it's ie. v1.0 and a second adaptation came out ie. v1.2 the ladder would still use v1.0 trying to load a v1.2 map when the server is running v1.0 will result in un matched files

Correct. Viiper... you are stating the EXACT issue.. in other words whoever wasn't upto date either would have to sit or go to God knows where to find the map (hopefully easier with this beta) This would lead to uneccesary delays in matching as most matches are for a few hours and most of us have to work the next day.

Peace also is correct in the issues. I won't install a custom map until everything is GRAW is finalized. Look at the problems users now have that got all the map packs? And now all the maps or an xml for them needs to be changed. This means unless your server removes them no one can play the beta there until Grin sorts out what is needed and everyone redownloads them

Note this is nothing against modders or BDA, but is how we (as a laddering clan) see it. I knew ahead of time there would be issues. Clan's that ladder need a clean server without these problems.

Hence Peace is asking Grin to think about converting some of the SP area's into maps. That's it.

I hope you understand our point here viiper as it's not an attack on you or an other map maker/modder, which is kinda how it your response makes it seem. It's just a suggestion, move on.

Edited August 30, 2006 by ROCOAFZ