Tortfeaser

There are soooo many variables that affect ballistic performance...for example, if the dummy had been wearing a plate carrier, the plate would have distributed more of the energy across the target's torso, with the end result being the body would have gone back further than 3 inches...

Guys forgive me for asking this, but in response to the info above about 'other games' coming out, I was not aware there were any tac sims, or even just comparable shooters coming out? I know this may not be the best thread for an extended discussion on this, but could someone post a short response as to what other games are coming out? [Post's split into own new thread]

I thought that was just my cheap sound system.....hmmm I heard it too.

Please look at this question from a marketing perspective only. Would a pre-Christmas release of the demo get UBI more "buzz" than a january release? I'm thinking the association of GR3 with the holidays would be excellent for marketing...(Im not talking about whether other factors prevent such a release) What do you guys think? If you owned a game company with a long expected release that could not be delivered to stores until, say Feb 1, of any given year, and also assume you could release a demo and the only question was when, 1. what would be some reasons you would want to wait till, say, mid January? 2. When people think of "Christmas" it has a nostalgic effect - you smell the tree, the cookies baking, you hear the music, can picture the lights....So is the mental association of a demo release with Christmas in and of itself, worth doing? Finally, please take this post for what it is...my attempt at interesting and constructive discussion. I ask that you keep your replies constructive, and I know you will. Thanks.

I think this is a situation of a magazine taking chances witwh advertising that resulted in a situation of it selling something it didn't own, promising something it couldn't deliver. I'm sure this is not the first time the magazine has made such a claim about a demo. They probably did not do it in bad faith or intentionally, just a miscommunication.

the only two things I have seen that are visible traveling downrange are .45 ACP rounds when the sunis behind you, you can watch them travel downrange at around 850 fps, and the other is a sabot round from an abrams tank, same scenario with sun behind you, you may see a glint for a fraction of a millisecond, but smoke trails? no.

well, of course. but we that doesn't mean we can't talk about it does it? It's just that we have some time to fill (oh, say 4 months) and I thought it may be interesting conversation. Whether it is interesting or not, at least it's not bickering! Let me also repeat that when the shooting starts you can't hear anything anyway, even the rounds going off aren't as loud and youhave continued ringing in your ears depending on what you were firing. But we can pipe music through tanks, apcs, and hummers all the way to the objective rally point. (ORP). From that point forward, of course no one has a walkman on.

, well, i like it....in fact, it has been my theme in life in the recent past.... but for a game or tac sim it may be found objectionable by some regulatory industry...we don't want GRAW under the gun for excessive violence...even we know war is all about taking lives with force and violence.

I think we may be jumping the gun here....Shouldn't we get confirmation from UBI first? I think if we assume a demo is coming, we may be setting ourselves up for dissappointment. No promises yet, right guys? I think it would be fair to assume that a delay of the game would also imply a "pushing back" of all events in the timeline, includikng a delay of any demo that may or may not have been planned. While I would not expect a press release, this matter would certainly warrant clarification if anything would.

holdin out on us! Aha!

Think of it this way: every Vietnam movie has THE vietnam song..."I can't get no....satisfaction..." What is the song of today's warrior? Is it a somber "braveheart theme" with a Scottish flavor? Is it decidedly American like Aaron Copeland's Rodeo? (That's the "Beef - it's what's for dinner" song.) Is it some metal group with a metal name no one has heard of? (did Quake make Nine Inch Nails or vice versa?). Today's soldiers like all kinds of music. I mentioned Johnny Cash because you can actually get away with playing some as long as you throw in Korn. Besides asking the question what music will we see, I want to know what music should we see.

For the former soldiers (and for everyone else, for that matter!) What music do you think would be appropriate for GRAW? If any? Every soldier should have his own favorite "riding into battle" type music, basically what you jam in and push play on in your vehicle (while humvees don't have tape decks, we always have some music somehow) Here are my favorites...."when the man comes around" johnny cash. Also, "i walk the line" also by Johnny Cash. "let the bodies hit the floor" is generally acceptable. The theme to Blackhawk down was used with incredible effect in some mods. Sooo, what should be the music of GRAW? What say you, fans?! EDIT: OOH, OOH, Enter Sandman by Metallica! (metallica is so protective of their music, not a chance though...) EDIT 2: Once the shooting starts, you can't hear ANYTHING anyway....

This article hit Ghost Recon.net 2 weeks ago but we had to remove the media for Copyright Rules. Now its avialable on Look Smart. If you missed it the first time round. Preview Link Colin ← excuse me, Colin, but "hit the deck" would be for ....ahem....a Navy game..... In the Army it is either "Grenade" or 'Incoming." Consider yourself reprimanded!

no, not shooting a few of you guys well maybe but something I'm reallylooking forward to is the edimensional unit. http://www.edimensional.com/product_info.p...ate_banner_id=1 Have any of you guys tried this with modern games? Is it worth the moolah? thanks. EDIT - sorry if I put this in the wrong forum, wasn't sure where it should go. I guess I needto add this: I have held off buying it as no game up to now had the visual possibility that GRAW has - HL2 was close, but no cigar.

on the lighter side, what if you made them all "mastermind" type characters - I wonder if they's argue or call some sort of meeting to determine how to best counterattack

I think what everyone is trying to say is, ...... NO. Only facts we have is we are getting something for modding, and that Bo described it as sandbox-like which doesnt mean jack because I can describe an Eatch A Sketch as sandbox-like.So its reasonable to assume from the facts what we may get the best moding tools ever made for a game, or the crappiest, or something in between. ← OK, no problem! But please understand my persistence throughout this dead silence is because there was pure emotional weeping/gnashing of teeth over in the other thread, cries of heresy, vows to never buy the game, accusations of blind fanboys, and so on, and for a minute I felt it fair to re-assess my own position outside the context of that thread. (the other thread degraded so much it was then shut down). Since i felt the main problem was a lack of modability, (Iguess? Still don't know really what the prob lem is) I wanted to give someone the chance to wipe the emotion off the table, and replace it with facts/reasonable assumptions in this thread. As you can see, couple of folks wanted to 1. rehash hurt feelings over GR2, or; 2. to give a "just because" type answer, or to 3. flippantly suggest a re-reading of their last 2 months of tirade, probably because they complained so much for so long, they even forgot why they are mad. So as for respectfully educating the rest of us on facts, so far, no takers. But the thread is young. There has been the suggestion, as I understand it with my limited computer knowledge, that the new GRAW may make modding to a limited extent more available to regular gamers with no special skills. I'm really trying to figure this out.

Papa 6, thanks for the reply, but I was really hoping to get technical data (to the extent that we know) dummed down for me to understand, as to why GRAW is not moddable... Your post seemed to be hard feelings over GR2, which is basically water under the bridge and has NOTHING to do with GRIN. ( so you know, I was upset over that, and frankly still don't excuse it, but we are few months away from something awesome and that's all I can think about right now!) So any hard facts/reasonable assumptions pertaining to moddability?

Born to Kill, let me get this straight...the perceived changes will open modding up to a larger audience? Are you saying if they use sandbox it will simplify making maps/missions? Understand I have no PC knowledge like the rest of the folks here.

We may be talking apples and oranges, element11....My post was not directed at anyone at GRIN or UBI, but to some of our own members who have complained as if they have a factual basis to do so. I just wanted to present an opportunity for reasoned education of folks like me, without the hurt feelings. so far, no one who has been complaining has stepped up to provide a factual basis for their opinions.

Well I just wanted to start a discussion based on facts, reasonable assumptions, inferences, instead of blind emotion. We have a vociferous few who have made it clear they won't buy GR:AW, that no one else should either, and those that disagree are called "ignorant." Here's their chance to educate the rest of us (don' talk over our heads guys, stay down here where regular gamers operate!) instead of just trying to enlist a blind following. I really want to know more about why folks feel the way they do.

well, my point is this: negative opinons have been formed. In order to fairly evaluate those opinions, it's fair to examine the data underlying those negative opinions. If the data is conjecture, if it is an assumption based upon error, or if the data is not fairly subject to differing interpretations, then we can all be on the same sheet of music. What data is out there that would tell us it is moddable or not?

I know we've had a firestorm of sabre rattling over the last several weeks, but let's take a good hard look at this. To those that know, on a scale of 1-10, with GR being 10, how modable will GR: AW be? How do we know? (i'm sure we have information that has been released that tends to suggest it is or it aint) Just because it differs from GR, does that mean it is not able to be modified? Can it mean it is still modifyable, just that ti will require a different skillset to do it? educate me here.

this just got me thinking....... we aint gonna get a demo if this is the case....... cant afford for us to turn round and point out everything wrong and bad mouth the game (assuming of course its not up to standard and doesn't contain the old GR spirit ---- come on grin, prove me wrong ) ....... ← well, I'd say you're right. If.................and I'm assuming a lot here.....................if WK was correct above, a demo would have the same effect as releasing the full game, ergo no demo. There are people who are saying essentially they won't buy it if it's not as mod-able, and therefore no one should buy it, (?) and they have not even played it yet. It does not matter what UBI/GRIn puts out, there are a vocal few who will have nothing good to say since they have some ax to grind. So with this unique dynamic if you were UBI would you let GRIN release a demo? We keep asking GRIN to do so when they finish the game, but chances are even when they get it finished GRIN's hands are tied.