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check under.. this forum part, Z posted, it's called Yo, he got injured in cqb in Iraq.

lol, yes I saw that like -oh- 10 seconds after I posted, strange how things like that happen ........

CLARK

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Rifle: M25 topped with a Aimpoint 7000SC 2x

Pistol: H&K Mk23. Mod 0, Wilson's Combat Tactical Series M1911a1 (Not a bad way to spend $2,000 :P , it gives "sex pistol" a whole new meaning :shifty: )

Sub-Machine Gun: H&K MP5 "Navy"

Machine Gun: M249 SAW "Para", M60E4

Shotgun: Benelli M4 Super

Sniper Rifle: M40A3 with "its" Unertl 10x mil-dot scope.

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A little off-topic, I know, but...

For the last time, "tumbling" in 5.56 and similar cartridges is 99% hype. The 5.56 wasn't chosen because it caused massive hydrostatic shock and splintering, it was chosen because it allowed a soldier to carry more ammo, fire more rounds before reloading and sustain a higher rate of controlled fire.

That's because it is TINY. To offset the negative effects of the round's tinyness on troop confidence, the brass spread stories of how the little round had magical properties, which allowed it to strike a VC in the wrist, break into ten pieces and then do laps around his torso until his entire body burst into flames and exploded (some exagerration).

I've seen pictures of 5.7 and 4.6 rounds (FN P90 and HK PDW, respectively) after going through various people simulants, and they mostly just drill little holes. One 5.7 round went through a 5 in thick pork shoulder (right through the bone) without so much as a dent. And I've seen coroner reports on people shot with 7.62 NATO rounds (Brit L1A1 FN-FALs) exibiting a lot of the in-body deflection and yawing attritbuted to 5.56 rounds. So, the light "wonder bullets" don't do anything that larger bullets don't do as well (within a comparable range of calibers- obviously a 22-250 and a 50 BMG don't perform the same on human targets, though if you had enough ballistic gelatin to track the the entire wound channel of a 50 you might find that it's just a difference in scale).

In short, don't believe everything the BRASS told the TROOPS in NAM. I've heard some of it was a bit suspect.

Edited by mob
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In my post the use of the word "tumbling" in regard to the M855 round is simply literal. I know the idea that a round will enter the knee and exit the shoulder is compleatly redicleus. What I ment was that the round, on impact and in the air to an extent, does not fly periclty strait, it will gyroscope around it's center of mass and impact start to tumble - that it flip end over end, but still in a relativly strait line - causing massive damge. The new SS109 ammo is much to stable to do that, it will fly strait and as a side-effect also penetrate strait through a person. The only hope you have with a 5.56 is that is fragments on impact.

The Soviet 5.45X39mm round is exelent, they left a small air pocket at the frount of the round so that when the round hits all the lead filling will move up into that air pocket upsetting the rounds center-of-mass causing it to tumble (again literal meaning of the word). The US has not adapted this type of ammo for "humanitarian" reasons

Fav. LMG: M-60E4!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(IMO the first really good weapon in the line of M-60s)

CLARK

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Sorry for going off the handle there, Viper... it's just that by some coincidence every time I've read the news in the last few days I see some Channel 5 hack trying to play ballistics expert, which burns the balls of a well-researched gun nut like myself. If I see one more report about "snipers" (killers who bother hiding) using "high-caliber rifles" (Bushmaster AR-15 .223) at "extreme ranges" (100 yards) with "expert marksmanship" (center of mass at 100 yards), I'm gonna pull out my accuracy-in-journalism bat and make terrible, terrible news....

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Sorry for going off the handle there, Viper... it's just that by some coincidence every time I've read the news in the last few days I see some Channel 5 hack trying to play ballistics expert, which burns the balls of a well-researched gun nut like myself. If I see one more report about "snipers" (killers who bother hiding) using "high-caliber rifles" (Bushmaster AR-15 .223) at "extreme ranges" (100 yards) with "expert marksmanship" (center of mass at 100 yards), I'm gonna pull out my accuracy-in-journalism bat and make terrible, terrible news....

yah, know exactly what you're talking about ..... I remember when they found out who the DC "sniper" was and everybody was making a big deal about the fact that he had an M-16 acuracy medel - all the news people where saying he was a trained sniper and whatnot when all he really did was hit a few more targets in his basic M-16 qual.

@Marcinko - isen't the Mk. 48 basicly the same thing as the M-60E4 or am I thinking of some other Mk. #?

CLARK

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You're thinking of the Mk43 Mod 0.

The Mk48 Mod 0 is basically a FN m249 scaled up to fire 7.62 Nato

gottcha, sometimes I have a hard time keeping all these Mk. # LMGs strait .... isen't there also a Mk. # FN weapon that is a 5.56mm SAW with a 4-phase RIS on the hard guard?

CLARK

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@Viper,Sep 2 2003, 13:41

Sorry for going off the handle there, Viper... it's just that by some coincidence every time I've read the news in the last few days I see some Channel 5 hack trying to play ballistics expert, which burns the balls of a well-researched gun nut like myself. If I see one more report about "snipers" (killers who bother hiding) using "high-caliber rifles" (Bushmaster AR-15 .223) at "extreme ranges" (100 yards) with "expert marksmanship" (center of mass at 100 yards), I'm gonna pull out my accuracy-in-journalism bat and make terrible, terrible news....

yah, know exactly what you're talking about ..... I remember when they found out who the DC "sniper" was and everybody was making a big deal about the fact that he had an M-16 acuracy medel - all the news people where saying he was a trained sniper and whatnot when all he really did was hit a few more targets in his basic M-16 qual.

Greetings!

At the heart of this was actually a rant against private ownership of rifles from the media.

The slant was this---"these M16/AR15's are so dangerous that any fool can make sniper shots within a couple hours of practice". :ph34r:

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BTW I agree with ur annoyance with the catagorising of "snipers" in the media.

I laughed when I saw the news that the shot "Could have been as far away as 100feet"! I am a bit annoyed at the media and them giving real snipers a bad name by making them appear to be loonie men with high calliber rifles.

I don't know if you guys know this but in the first Gulf War a sniper armed with a .50cal M82A1 hit and killed an enemy troop from 1,800 meters away now that's a true sniper not someone who can hit a body at 100ft and get a kill shot.

Sorry if I ranted but I needed to get it out of my system to people who truely understand.

Cobra :wall:

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somthin like this....

yah, that's exactly what I was talking about! what Mod is that for and has it been reliesed?

to clear up some confusion on this (now that I got my names right) The origonal gun was the Minimi, a LSW made by FN, a Belgin company. When the US was looking for a LSW to replace the M-60 as thier standard troop weapon they made some small changes to the Minimi (mostly machinery changes for prduction in the US, as well as the addition of a heat-shield over the top of the barrel, the only visual differance) The US then adapted this modified Minimi as the M-249 SAW.

Two commando weapons of this type exist, one is simply a shorter version of the US M-249, with a shortend barrel and hand-guard; it also has a collapsable stock. This weapon is usualy repered to as the Para-SAW. (this weapon is in Earl's Standard Upgrade) the other Spec-Ops weapon is the FN Mk. 46, a shorter version of the Minimi, but this weapon instead of simply using shortend full-size handguard uses a RIS all around the barrel, allowing for many more attachments (but usualy at the expense of the bi-pod)

another one of my fav. LSWs for sure, Mk. 46 with forward handgrip, AN/PEQ-2 IRSP, AN/PVS-14B MNVD, and Aimpoint CompXD red-dot sight

(see below pic :D )

CLARK

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