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Finishing GRAW1 in CO-OP, looking into GRAW2


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Dear all,

I am currently playing GRAW1 in co-op with 2 friends and we are having a blast. It has proven to be a very good tactical fps game indeed.

We are nearing the end of GRAW1, so I am looking into GRAW2 on behalf of our little group. Just so you know where we are coming from, I can tell you that we have played every R6 game until LetDown, GR + DS + IT and SWAT4 + SS in co-op together.

We have played the GRAW2 demo, and I have a couple of questions that I hope you can help us with.

1) Mission length

The demo mission in GRAW2 seems very very short in comparision with the very long missions (which we like) in GRAW1. Is this typical for all missions in GRAW2 or just the demo mission?

2) Difficulty

The demo mission (and AI) in GRAW2 seems very easy compared with GRAW1. Is this typical for all GRAW2 missions?

3) Respawns

We seem to have infinite respawns in the demo mission. Can this be user specified or turned off?

4) Patches

I can see that 4 patches for GRAW2. Do they enhance the game (options, gametypes etc) compared with the demo version or are they just bug fixes?

5) Overall

Will we like GRAW2 as much as we love GRAW1 in co-op?

I thank you very much in advance for your replies.

:) Mike

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I'm sure others might beg to differ, but here's my opinion on the matter.

1) Some missions are of decent length and some are just like the demo mission. The best way to do it is to play nice and slow, which can turn a small map from a 10 minute mission to a 45 minute mission. If you run and gun your way through though, it'll be very short.

2) The AI isn't exactly intelligent. If you all have rifles with silencers you can pretty easily go through a mission without being spotted by the enemy. The balance IMO for coop is a rifle with sights but no silencers, a secondary with a silencer, and a silenced pistol. Quiet up close, but you have to take a ranged shot you'll alert a few others rather than going though without being seen. Another thing that makes it easier is that you can enable respawns in campaign coop, requiring even less stealth and encouraging more run and gun tactics.

3) Your respawns can be specified. I thought they could in the demo too though. In the menu where you are setting it all up look at the bottom, and make sure you scroll all the way down. The options for respawn are down there.

4) Bug fixes.

5) Again this is a matter of opinion. I liked both games coops, but GRAW 2s coop is still bugged with the crosscom system, or being unable to order your human teammates to go assault or stealth. I like them both though, and GRAW 2 has a little more variety in terms of replayability and weapons. For example, there is a mission that is damn near perfect in the style of [GR] (Get Me Rosen). Try doing that map with silenced pistols only and a MP5 with a scope. A LOT of fun.

Hope this helped!

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I'm sure others might beg to differ, but here's my opinion on the matter.

...

(snip)

...

Hope this helped!

Thanks a lot Nutlink - it most certainly did! It was very kind of you to take the time to answer my questions.

We will take our chances and go buy GRAW2 today (thereby boosting GRAW2 sales :shifty: ...)!

Thanks again, mate.

:) Mike

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OUCH. I thought a 7950 would be quite alright for this game. I ran the first GRAW on a 6800GT for a while (then got my second one in and flipped the SLi 'fun switch').

Anyhow, I'll agree that the campaign COOP in GRAW and GRAW2 can be fun. It'd be better, in my opinion, if you could go 6-9 to a team, and even better yet if the beautiful maps weren't tied-down to linear gameplay. But I used to enjoy a little pickup 4-man COOP on GRAW once in a while. The CrossCom orders system was actually pretty handy there, and I found it was fairly satisfying to play along with some other relatively experienced folks and follow orders to get from A to Z.

That being said, there's a lot more to the game than just COOP. The extra cinematics and such, IMO, RUINED the SP campaign, as did the STILL-LINEAR gameplay. I never bothered finishing it in SP. And the kits for adversarial COOP modes in GRAW2 leave me shaking my head in amazement. SOMEONE ought to be slapped for that.

But if you have the money laying around anyway, you enjoyed GRAW, and you're willing to extend a little faith to UBI (2 of the three I am NOT) then go right ahead and pick up GRAW2. In it's defense...

The engine seems improved over GRAW.

Physics no longer bog-down the game as badly (didn't GRIN drop Havok?)

Weapon selection is somewhat improved.

Maps are a LITTLE BIT more open, allowing more than one approach to some objectives.

I was personally VERY fond of the orders placeholders in the CrossCom 2.0.

Good luck!

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I have a 7900GTX, and GRAW 2 runs like crap on my computer. Ironic, cause Rainbow Six Vegas, another Tom Clancy game, runs better on my computer AND looks better.

Call of Duty 4 also runs better on my computer AND looks better.

Anyway, as far as your questions go, here's my 2 cents:

1) Mission length

I don't run and gun, and I still thought that GRAW 2 campaign was short, along with each individual mission. There's one mission where you just have to walk from start to finish, fire an RPG, and the mission was over. Strange developing. Even UT2004 mods had better design.

2) Difficulty

Easy? Well, if you mean easy as in not using your teammates at all, then yes, you're right. Other than that, it seems that the AI in GRAW 2 is worse, if not the same.

3) Respawns

User-specified.

4) Patches

Already answered: just bug fixes.

5) Overall

Ha. No. Are you kidding? It's gotten the worst reviews, and frankly, I have to agree. It's not the greatest game ever. And frankly, it's not even an average game. Just look at Armed Assault or SWAT 4. Those games were tactical, and didn't suck.

Seriously, GRAW 2 on PC plays and feels like a game that was made 2 years ago. I have GRAW 2 on the XBOX360 and frankly, I have to say the 360 version is better.

After all... How can a game designer make Mexico City look like a ###### 3rd world country? Gosh... They stereotyped Mexico. Have you been to Mexico in real life? It's a lively place, even in places like Tijuana. It ain't third world.

360 version of GRAW 2 = better investment. Less frustration.

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I have a 7900GTX, and GRAW 2 runs like crap on my computer. Ironic, cause Rainbow Six Vegas, another Tom Clancy game, runs better on my computer AND looks better.

...

...

(snip)

...

...

360 version of GRAW 2 = better investment. Less frustration.

Thanks for your 2 cents neilthecellist, they are appreciated.

Well, as we do not have anything better (tactical fps 4-man LAN CO-OP) in sight, we are "forced" to go on with GRAW2 once we are finished with GRAW1 (in 2 weeks) :)

I just needed some feedback from you guys before we went out and spent our money.

I must say that I personally think (from my experience with GRAW2 demo mission) we probably would have been better off with "just" an expansion pack for GRAW1 than GRAW2.

:) Mike

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I have a 7900GTX, and GRAW 2 runs like crap on my computer. Ironic, cause Rainbow Six Vegas, another Tom Clancy game, runs better on my computer AND looks better.

...

...

(snip)

...

...

360 version of GRAW 2 = better investment. Less frustration.

Thanks for your 2 cents neilthecellist, they are appreciated.

Well, as we do not have anything better (tactical fps 4-man LAN CO-OP) in sight, we are "forced" to go on with GRAW2 once we are finished with GRAW1 (in 2 weeks) :)

I just needed some feedback from you guys before we went out and spent our money.

I must say that I personally think (from my experience with GRAW2 demo mission) we probably would have been better off with "just" an expansion pack for GRAW1 than GRAW2.

:) Mike

In reference to the tech specs above, I'd have to take issue with naming a video card as the sole reason for poor game performance. I have 7900GS' (two on SLi) in my laptop, at 256K each, and it runs pretty smooth on some ralatively aggressive settings. Even with just ONE card running, GRAW2 does alright. The key? 2GB RAM.

I'd certainly recommend dual-core processors for any modern video games, but especially for GRAW/GRAW2 where physics weigh heavily on the processor. I'm an Athlon 64 X2 fan myself, but whatever works for you.

For the record, I ran GRAW on MEDIUM to HIGH settings on a pair of 6800GT cards at 256k each, but again was running 2GB RAM. Seriously, any less RAM makes little sense. It's a less-expensive alternative to the 8800GTX upgrade, and would probably do as much good toward improving performance.

Of course, if you're on a laptop your options are limited for RAM upgrades. You're on your own there.

Again, Mike, while I'm no fan of GRAW or GRAW2 necessarily, I wish you and your peeps good luck with the GRAW2 decision. If you enjoyed GRAW, you'll REALLY enjoy GRAW2.

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I just needed some feedback from you guys before we went out and spent our money.
For what it's worth, ;), at least you won't be paying the premium at this stage.

...we probably would have been better off with "just" an expansion pack for GRAW1 than GRAW2.
True.

If you enjoyed GRAW, you'll REALLY enjoy GRAW2.
Not necessarily true...particularly if he is coming from the Co-Op perspective.
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I'd have to disagree on the 7900GTX not working well in GRAW 2. I played the game at 1680x1050 with all settings maxed out with 2 of them in SLI, but I tested it a few times to see how it ran on just one card, and at 1280x1024 it still ran at 40+ FPS maxed out. At 1680x1050 it had a little chop here and there, but nothing that bad. I've since switched to a 8800GTS 640MB though, and while it's slower than 2 7900GTXs in SLI it produces less heat :)

And despite what some of these guys are saying, Campaign Coop is a blast. Normal coop on the other hand is actually pretty boring, especially with only 3 stock maps (most, if not all, of the custom maps are just campaign maps converted over for normal coop).

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I ran GRAw 2 at 1024 x 768 resolution, and I was already getting lag.

Here are my specs:

AMD 64 4200+ (overclocked to about 4500)

2 gigs of RAM, 800 mhz DDR2

7900 GTX 256 mb 16x pci-e

SATA I HD 80 GB (not rich enough for SATA II... yet)

And the game won't let me enable AGEIA.... Probably because my card doesn't support it?

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Sure it is! COOP sucked in GRAW, and it sucks in GRAW2. If you embraced the suck before, then welcome to more of it!

I completely disagree with you on GRAW1 CO-OP. IMO (my CO-OP buddies agree) LAN Campaign CO-OP is a blast on par with GR1, RvS and SWAT4 :)

Not that we need to agree on this :)

:) Mike

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@MadMike- if you enjoy that aspect of GRAW, then I think you'll find GRAW2 even better. I think of it more as GRAW-optimized.

Adversarial multiplayer gametypes, of course, are a WHOLE different matter, but SP and MP COOP I think are similar-but-improved.

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