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CoOp Weapons Kit Have to Go!


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Playing CoOp Quarry today on Hardcore and what a fantistic map compared to the SP version. Till I got to the three M1 Tanks partolling the Quarry with no Zeus Rockets to destroy them with. Seriously its not even an option under any of the loadouts to equip a Zeus. Just who on crack made up the CoOp weapons loadouts? :wall:

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GRIN view co-op as a bad smell mate and just wish we would go away.

I totally agree with you. All the advancements in GRAW2 MP was in the pvp sector. The co-op acually got downgraded from GRAW. And all the pleas of "please add free weapon selection in co-op" have been ignored again and again.

Funny how their new brainchild RvA pvp mode is not so popular however, due to lack of voice comms and teamwork. GRIn shouldnt have ditched co-op. There are man players like me who spend much more time killing bots thatn humans.

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I don't mind the class system and in fact like it. You can use the RPG with the demolitions class and get a M8 compact to take out the tanks easily. There is plenty of variety in the classes and shouldn't be changed if you ask me. I'm starting to think some people might not know that you can change the weapons for each class by clicking the little squares under each class. Only in RvsA do you need to get veterancy to gain better weapons. GRIN shouldn't change a thing about the coop.

PS:The idea that GRAW2 coop has taken a step back from GRAW is just naive. Now we have actual objectives in coop. Also, now you can be stealthy in coop just like in the sp. For just these reasons alone, the new GRAW2 coop is much better than the [GR] coop in GRAW.

Edited by Demanufakture
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if you ask me. I'm starting to think some people might not know that you can change the weapons for each class by clicking the little squares under each class.

No one did , but since you are wanting to tell us so much and I obviously missed it when I clicked the little blue squares, which kit has the Anti Tank Rocket known as Zeus? (RPG's are not What I asked for btw)

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If the RPG was a Tank killer we would not be having this discussion. It takes more than one of them to do the job. And aside from the fact they did not include the Zeus in Any of the weapons kits why won't it work in CoOp.

Edit: Also if they wanted to limit you to a dumb fire AT type system (for the Challenge), they they should have put in a Real AT weapon like the LAW, or a few other current Active AT system currently fielded in the US or other military.

Edited by Fletch
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You are given 2 RPGs I believe, enough to take out a single tank. I'm not sure if the Zeus will work in coop or not, but locking on with the "fire and forget" isn't as hard as using the RPG. Personally I've never even used it because I prefer to plant C4 on a tank. And while it would have made more sense to possibly use something like a LAW it would have been something else they had to model rather than just use the RPG from GRAW 1.

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if you ask me. I'm starting to think some people might not know that you can change the weapons for each class by clicking the little squares under each class.

No one did , but since you are wanting to tell us so much and I obviously missed it when I clicked the little blue squares, which kit has the Anti Tank Rocket known as Zeus? (RPG's are not What I asked for btw)

The mission was desinged not to use the Zeus, it would be too easy. RPG is what you get.

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I'm not sure if the Zeus will work in coop or not, but locking on with the "fire and forget" isn't as hard as using the RPG.

It works in Coop. There is a kit for it in the templates, but it's not included in any *_ranks.xml.

Yep, no reason why your future cooperative maps cannot have them included. :thumbsup:

*Edit* Thnx for the continued constructive criticism McGhost, as always, noted.

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I also beleive that the kit's are really not needed in coop. I think the way that GRAW handled it was better and have said so before.

@Demanufakture, - In regards to CCOP taking a step back, it depends on how you look at it. Sure we now have more objectives which is a step in the right direction but initially out of the box that is the only positive that many see. The loss of choice in weapon selection, the loss of squads, the loss of spawn on leader to many represent 3 losses or steps back. Sure modders might be able to address some of these things and the flexible scripting might be able to overcome these but that is MIGHT. Right now we are not seeing that. I see less initiative to work together in squads because it's harder to stay organized for pubbers. The lack of forward spawning on respawn server makes players run and run and run to the action. And for me none of the kits represents what I would want to carry. Sure I might be able to get the primary I want with the attachments I would want (actually I can't since I cannot get a scope, silencer, and GL), but forget getting a secondary that I prefer or even a secondary with a scope or aimpoint. Never mind getting the smoke or hand grenades I would want. I could do that in GRAW but now I am tied to someone else's idea of what I should be balanced against in and adversarial game. Never mind that this is coop and balance verses the other kits doesn't mean squat.

See that is why people feel it's a step backwards at this point. If you had to ask which I currently prefer, GRAW1 or GRAW2. Right now given what is available, I definitely prefer the GRAW1 gameplay even though it doesn't have multiple objectives. (even though some modders essentially put them in with C4 objects and such).

I understand why it is what it is with the kits. It's because GRIN is using a unified structure for ALL multiplayer gametypes that run on the dedicated server (this excludes campaign since it's not compatible with the dedicated server). This kept developement time down, saved money, and offers alot of flexibility for custom gametypes and modes. But it gutted what coop was in favor of the this. I don't know if this will prove to be a good thing for coop or a bad one. However it is what it is and will likely never change. Only time will tell what happens with coop and I'm sure players will get used to it or move on to other titles as they are released. Personally I'm going to keep playing and "deal" with the changes until something else comes along.

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I'm with those wanting selection screen back, no reason at all to go to restricted kits for [GR] coop. As there are no singleplayer gamemodes, this is the refuge of sp types for play other than original missions ( starting to think we sp types should have been much louder and more verbose--somebody may of taken notice, instead of our quiet requests for recon/ff modes where we could take ai with us). I would like to be able to load out with suppressed weapons, primary, secondary, sidearm and have 4 nades available not one--bad guys have all their goodies-why not us. You can't take ai with you so rambo is only way to go. Kits might have a place in MP games playing against humans not in coop against fully equipped ai. Sure I could sit down and make a huge template file of all possible loadouts, associate it with group manager, make the ranks file and associate it with each and every map for coop, and then try to figure out how to make new gameplay type to remove weapon restrictions, loadout amounts-very time consuming----why not just have the selection screen as one has in coop campaign?

Fletch, I never use an rpg in Quarry, each tank has a resting spot near a structure, just hide there, wait, and slap on the c4. I take out humans first, then go for tanks. Take your time and don't rush yourself,and a suppressed, scoped weapon from rifleman kits is very helpful.

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I'm tying to put some pieces tiogether from what I thought i read from wolf and others.

Irrespective of the old interfafce from GRAW1 (make your own loadout up to max weight), didn't Wolf say that custom kits ordered from existing weapons (not modded weapons) in the game wouldn't be hard to make?

So for some questions to wolf if he would be so kind....

---1. If a coop server were to turn off anticheat, and then unmodded weapons were organized into new kit selections client-side, couldn't players pretty much have whatever kit they want within weight limits?

so for example, if I wanted a kit that was an m99, an mp5sd6 and 3 nades and 3 smoke nades, i could have it. right?

---2. Are the kit choice mods going to be nothing more than xml files? or will scripting and higher skills be required to create them?

---3. Once kit alterations are created, could a server mod itself with those new kits and turn on anti cheat, so the only way it's member-clients could join would be to have the server's approved client-side kit mod? thus limiting all its players to the same kits?

Aren't all these possabilities the things you were talking about when you once mentioned the ability to mod kits?

If this is the case, then I expect kit selection mods to show up all over the place eventually.

final question.

---4. Can weight limits also be screwed with, so that kit mods can include 2 weps and 3 nades etc? or is it more than simply wieght? like is it there simply aren't 3 slots for nades and kit modding won't let you carry 3 nades?

Maybe I should post this as a top level post in the modding section?

Edited by Sleepdoc
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---1. If a coop server were to turn off anticheat, and then unmodded weapons were organized into new kit selections client-side, couldn't players pretty much have whatever kit they want within weight limits?

so for example, if I wanted a kit that was an m99, an mp5sd6 and 3 nades and 3 smoke nades, i could have it. right?

Yes. Kits like that can easily be made. There is no weight restriction either, just load up in the kit. don't know if they work server sided when anti-cheat is turned off though.

---2. Are the kit choice mods going to be nothing more than xml files? or will scripting and higher skills be required to create them?
XML only. Open a *_ranks.xml file and take a look, it's really easy to setup restrictions with the original kits. A little more work to create your own kits and/or classes, but it's described in one of the tutorials and is still only XML.

---3. Once kit alterations are created, could a server mod itself with those new kits and turn on anti cheat, so the only way it's member-clients could join would be to have the server's approved client-side kit mod? thus limiting all its players to the same kits?
Yes. With anti-cheat on both client and server has to have the same mod and it will be what determines the kits.

Aren't all these possabilities the things you were talking about when you once mentioned the ability to mod kits?
I think so.

If this is the case, then I expect kit selection mods to show up all over the place eventually.
I wouldn't be surprised... http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/index.php...=45703&st=0 :whistle:

---4. Can weight limits also be screwed with, so that kit mods can include 2 weps and 3 nades etc? or is it more than simply wieght? like is it there simply aren't 3 slots for nades and kit modding won't let you carry 3 nades?
As I wrote earlier in this post, there is no weight limit. It's only int he selection screen for SP /Campaign Coop to limit the player in some way. The only limit is that you can only have 1 primary weapon (with any options, but not GL and fronthandle at the same time), 1 secondary weapon (with any options), 1 sidearm (with options), zeus, frag and smoke.
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If the RPG was a Tank killer we would not be having this discussion. It takes more than one of them to do the job. And aside from the fact they did not include the Zeus in Any of the weapons kits why won't it work in CoOp.

Edit: Also if they wanted to limit you to a dumb fire AT type system (for the Challenge), they they should have put in a Real AT weapon like the LAW, or a few other current Active AT system currently fielded in the US or other military.

I've destroyed the tanks in quarry many times with just one RPG. I don't know if it matters where you hit them with the RPG, but it is possible to take out all 3 tanks with just one RPG loadout.

I never thought of planting C4 on them lol. I'll have to try that.

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---2. Are the kit choice mods going to be nothing more than xml files? or will scripting and higher skills be required to create them?

Of course you can mod the xml files, but that means that whenever I want a new weapon combination I have to quit GRAW2 and change the files, then start up again. I often change my weapons after every round in Coop, and once there are lots of new modded weapons the amount of possible combinations goes way up.

Come on, balance is irrelevant in Coop, the interface is already there in Campaign Coop, so why not give us free, easy, fast weapon selection?

Edit:

Or best, let the creator of the map decide wether to enable free selection or kit restriction. Some Coop Maps/Game modes might only make sense with restricted weapons...

Edited by Drakane
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Well I'll say it again because none of the comments here have made me change my mind. The class system works just fine in GRAW2 coop. If you like GRAW coop better you can still play it you know. I have GRAW and GRAW2 installed and play both of them. I understand how some people don't like it but you guys don't get to choose how GRIN designs the game. I like the direction GRIN went. So complain all you want but I don't think GRIN is going to suddenly change how the coop weapon selection works just because SOME people don't like it. You guys that don't like the way it is will either have to make a mod or wait for someone else to make a mod.

Once again, GRIN did a great job on the coop and I thank them for it. :g_withgrin:

Edited by Demanufakture
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If the RPG was a Tank killer we would not be having this discussion. It takes more than one of them to do the job. And aside from the fact they did not include the Zeus in Any of the weapons kits why won't it work in CoOp.

Edit: Also if they wanted to limit you to a dumb fire AT type system (for the Challenge), they they should have put in a Real AT weapon like the LAW, or a few other current Active AT system currently fielded in the US or other military.

I have to say this game in that RPG and zeus theme is BS. an M1 Abrams uses depleted uranium for armor, one of the toughest materials to crack. and an RPG can't completely, I mean completely kill an M1, maybe throw a track but kill an M1? hell no-. I feel like that quarry coop map is like they line you up against godzilla and you have to try and kill him with a spoon, my point: we are under armed for that mission.

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