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TDM Spawn Killing


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While perusing the TDM rules XML I found this:

<!-- Give no ponts for killing players inside their spawnzone -->

<element type="SetKillScoreLocation" location="tdm_spawn_a" set="true" side="2" score="-1" />

<element type="SetKillScoreLocation" location="tdm_spawn_b" set="true" side="1" score="-1" />

Can anyone confirm whether or not this is working?

P.S. I think this is great, especially once people find out they are not getting points for spawn raping.

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While perusing the TDM rules XML I found this:

<!-- Give no ponts for killing players inside their spawnzone -->

<element type="SetKillScoreLocation" location="tdm_spawn_a" set="true" side="2" score="-1" />

<element type="SetKillScoreLocation" location="tdm_spawn_b" set="true" side="1" score="-1" />

Can anyone confirm whether or not this is working?

P.S. I think this is great, especially once people find out they are not getting points for spawn raping.

I worked when we tested it. And I wrote about it during the MP demo discussions so people should know it's in there.

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People here might know, if they even read that discussion & happen to remember. But there is no other indication (to the general public) that that feature exists. Of course, they (people outside GR.net) could extract that information from the bundle, but I find that scenario unlikely.

Anyway, I know that was discussed as far back as the beta, so I'm glad it made it into the retail version!

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When you are killed after spawning within 15 seconds the shooter should be the one that dies.

Could easily be put into the server options.

Thats just being silly. Thats what invulnerability is for. Some maps are made for spawn camping unfortunately. However in this game I must point out that you can't BE in someones spawn or you will get rolled cuz of their invulnerability. Therefore trying to kill someone as they spawn is impossible. Maps like Nowhere and Timber come to mind for being very easy to set up very forward positions once an opposing team gets to a certain point in the map, the teeter-totter tips and it just turns into a spawn camp of sorts. You just wait for them to run out and bang.

The point is, its not the points or gratification that leads to spawn camping. Its one team or person overpowering another along a certain a route to the opposing spawn in a map. I mean a few of you might be happy to sit in a bush and wait for someone to come along, but I find that boring and so does most of everyone I see in servers playing. Most people want to engage not camp. So if a player keeps moving forward, eventually the player ends up at the opposing spawn. Now they can't move forward anymore, and its very risky to run side to side so they stay in a good position with cover, outside the spawn. Eventually people figure it out and either through GL's or nades or teamwork clear out the camper. I ask you this though... how is this kind of camping any better or worse than camping a high traffic area hiding in a bush?. They are just simply at the end of the road! Camping is camping no matter where it is on the map. Admins all you need to do is give your server a few extra seconds of invulnerablity. I have timed it, most maps do not have enough time at spawn to get to cover from your spawn with the default invulnerability delay. Thus people the get ###### camped out of them because no matter what they can't find cover fast enough. Put it up to ten seconds at least. Yes the lack of points will deter some spawn rapers. But its not the real solution as I see it.

Its more a gameplay/map design issue than anything else. Give people a means to escape the spawn on the maps where spawn camping is really common. But then we are just gonna have posts about bush campers instead of the spawn camping posts.

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Nice to see that even the developers of the game frown on spawn killing.

I often play on the 22sas server. They have a no spawn killing rule and they're pretty decent about enforcing it.

Maybe spawn campers should look at their scores now and then... ;)

22SAS good bunch / fun

Maybe spawn campers should look at their scores now and then... ;)

:D

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Stalker' date='Aug 14 2007, 06:46 PM' post='487953']

No respawns, no spawn raping. Simple and effective.

Unless it's a match boring!

Maybe for battlefield junkies, but not for tdm fans. It's a blast. You think before you round each corner.

As a question. How big are the spawns as they are not marked.

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Opti, I think you're looking at it the wrong way. Use the dead time to fix yourself a sandwich, a glass of your favorite beverage, and re-dose yourself with A.D.D. meds. If the time limit is 5-7 minutes and you don't rush around like a BF2'er on crack, you usually don't have to wait very long for the next round, if at all. If you have no respawns, guess what? No one else does either. The rounds are over quickly. If you truly can't stand to observe for a minute or two, I'm not sure GR is the right game for you (the collective "you", not necessarily you specifically Opti). Honestly, it seems like the 3-to-infinite respawn crowd is trying to turn this game into something it was never meant to be. As far as I know there are still BF2, BF2142, ETQW, and other servers out there where you can run around like a ###### blasting away at everything in sight with as many lives as you need to fill your kill quota. GR was always a slow paced game since the beginning and meant to be played carefully and deliberately, thus the "Recon" in the name. Otherwise just rename it "Ghost Melee" or "Ghost Respawn" or "CounterGhost Source" or "BattleGhost 2"...I got a million of 'em.

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<!-- Give no ponts for killing players inside their spawnzone -->

<element type="SetKillScoreLocation" location="tdm_spawn_a" set="true" side="2" score="-1" ban=true/false kick=true/false/>

<element type="SetKillScoreLocation" location="tdm_spawn_b" set="true" side="1" score="-1" ban=true/false kick=true/false/>

perhaps add the bolded areas to the feature?

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Stalker' date='Aug 15 2007, 10:52 AM' post='487962']

Honestly, it seems like the 3-to-infinite respawn crowd is trying to turn this game into something it was never meant to be.

If it was never meant to be then why does the [Ghost Recon] allow the number of respawns to be set anywhere from 0 to infinity? Perhaps it was a function RSE left in by mistake eh?

When all we had was the demo there were people posting here that they didnt like respawns and that when the retail came out they would have a no respawn server. Some have actually put up such servers and some people play on them. The large majority of servers have respawns and the large majority of players still play on servers offering respawns.

Granted in a match situation I am all for limited or no respawns but in a public server I want to play not watch.

I didnt buy the game to watch other people play it.

So I would say the collective 'us' respectfully disagree with the collective 'you' :rocky:

my 2 cents(aus)

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Stalker' date='Aug 15 2007, 10:52 AM' post='487962']

Honestly, it seems like the 3-to-infinite respawn crowd is trying to turn this game into something it was never meant to be.

If it was never meant to be then why does the [Ghost Recon] allow the number of respawns to be set anywhere from 0 to infinity? Perhaps it was a function RSE left in by mistake eh?

When all we had was the demo there were people posting here that they didnt like respawns and that when the retail came out they would have a no respawn server. Some have actually put up such servers and some people play on them. The large majority of servers have respawns and the large majority of players still play on servers offering respawns.

Granted in a match situation I am all for limited or no respawns but in a public server I want to play not watch.

I didnt buy the game to watch other people play it.

So I would say the collective 'us' respectfully disagree with the collective 'you' :rocky:

my 2 cents(aus)

Maybe infinate was for the Arcade mode ;) GR1 players will love that comment :D

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the problem is, while some who have zero respawns on, you'll always have some run n' gun bunny racing his butt off to get the most kills and just running around mad.

on the other hand, if you take your time, then you get called a camper and people will complain and moan.

I have to say from all observation during play, I have NEVER seen GRAW2 played like [GR] to any extent. Some here have so eloquently put it, GRAW/GRAW2 was never meant to be [GR] or it's successor. what does this mean?

there is no tactical gameplay and the gameplay is arcade'ish.

I played a spell on WDA's server this evening and this clan =SFS= proudly stood right across from our spawn on nowhereTDM and just naded and picked off me and my team. this game has attracted a really bad crowd. not you guys here at all, but the cruft of gits that horde on servers in an endless display of spawnkill competition.

I did mention that if they could please move back from spawn and got no reply, some kid was probably laughing his ###### headoff while killing us in spawn. that's what makes games die. someone wants to enjoy a game and not some greasy headed punk who's mommy bought him a puter. :rofl: just jacking a server up. this is also why I'm terribly angry with Grin about no REAL dedicated server feature in GRAW2 whereby an IP can manually be setup and accessed outside of Gamespy. I wonder, if we set ALL UBISOFT employees down and force fed them all these crappy games down THEIR throats..would they get the picture?- no, too stupid.

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...If it was never meant to be then why does the [Ghost Recon] allow the number of respawns to be set anywhere from 0 to infinity? Perhaps it was a function RSE left in by mistake eh?

Nice try. They also included a bunch of console command cheat codes in [GR]. Just because it's included doesn't mean it makes the game better.

I stand by everything I said. My point is that there are plenty of run 'n gun arcade slaughterfests out there. It would be a shame for a game with as much potential as this one to become just another one of those, because it will never be as popular as those other games and that style doesn't play to GRAW 2's strengths.

...the large majority of players still play on servers offering respawns...

If I followed "the large majority", I'd be playing something else. The large majority of players play those other games I mentioned, not GRAW 2. The majority of players I recognize from [GR] seem to prefer no respawns. I also recall that most of the more popular [GR] servers back in the day (including our own ]RS[ Battlefield) were set for no respawns.

Being in the majority doesn't automatically equal being right. Examples of this are endless.

Granted in a match situation I am all for limited or no respawns but in a public server I want to play not watch.

I didnt buy the game to watch other people play it.

Use teamwork. Don't die. If you are having difficulty accomplishing that, a little observing of the right players could help improve your game. I do more than my fair share of observing and hope to do less of it by learning a few tricks from people who have more time to play than I do.

Maybe infinate was for the Arcade mode.

:rofl:

So I would agree the collective "us" respectfully disagree with the collective "you". :rocky:

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Hey I like the run and gunners, find a nice spot settle in with a silenced weapon shoot a few move on and repeat. I prefer assault rifles and scopes and that works for me. I see very few crouched or prone players on TDM servers, and that also works to my advantage.

Being old and not the greatest mouse handler I still do ok, with this system.

As for respawns a small number rather than infinite is better, but camping spawn exits is going to happen and with minimal team play on TEAM deathmatch servers the team that gets to those locations in force will be hard to dislodge. Just gotta adapt.

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we had unlimited respwans on our server on all modes until we got used to the maps weapons etc......

now on hh it 1 on siege its 5 and we only have 2 tdm maps which also have 5 are server used to be full but now all we see is the players who we mostly played against in gr1 who were used to 1 life and tbh id rather have it that way that a full server of people and half of them moaning about be spawn raped tbh.

i like the idea of being kicked if you kill in the spawn that will put some players off.

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there is no tactical gameplay and the gameplay is arcade'ish.

Disagree. Hop on our server and see what tactical is all about.

I played a spell on WDA's server this evening and this clan =SFS= proudly stood right across from our spawn on nowhereTDM and just naded and picked off me and my team.

Are you playing respawn games? You get what you deserve in that instance.

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While perusing the TDM rules XML I found this:

<!-- Give no ponts for killing players inside their spawnzone -->

<element type="SetKillScoreLocation" location="tdm_spawn_a" set="true" side="2" score="-1" />

<element type="SetKillScoreLocation" location="tdm_spawn_b" set="true" side="1" score="-1" />

Can anyone confirm whether or not this is working?

P.S. I think this is great, especially once people find out they are not getting points for spawn raping.

The spawn camper doesn’t receive points for spawn kills,

Does the victim in the spawn register a death to his score?

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This is a silly argument. On public servers, no respawn = no gameplay.

The people who would benefit the most from a no respawn rule would be those who simply pick a hidden spot and wait. That's about as riveting as watching paint dry. Let's not fancy it up or make it sound like it's something honorable. It's not tactics, it's called attrition - you bore your opponent into moving first, then you kill him and win.

The reason why camping is universally hated is because it's boring, not because it's hard. There's a clear difference between moving slowly, checking your surroundings, engaging the enemy and winning. That's called skill. Sitting in a bush or secluded spot (which is what most campers do), especially near the enemy's spawn exit points, is not particularly skillful, and would turn TDM into nothing more than TEDIUM.

What we really need is for this great option that Cangaroo has pointed out to be enabled, along with a decent amount of spawn protect (e.g. 5-8 seconds). This will force people to actually venture out of their own spawn, and try engaging the enemy in all sorts of different and interesting ways. It also forces people not to take the easy way out and camp around the enemy spawn, getting cheap kills.

Note that I've played many years of America's Army, where there is no respawn, but the rounds are limited to around 9-10 minutes. At least that way you're not waiting half an hour for that last entrenched camper to die. Also note that in America's Army despite all the attempts to make it more realistic and tactical, the no respawn idea has not resulted in any real tactical gameplay whatsoever.

Edited by PersianImmortal
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