why those kits?

[ita_killabees]

I played GRAW. Never found a game that could make me that angry (expecially when i died killed by a man that was still runnning )

But i hoped in GRAW 2.

And, trying the demo, i saw many great improvements of the online gameplay.

But then, as i wanted to select my gun, i saw thoe terrible, awful kits.

Why, why this jump in the past? One of the great limitations of GR1 is back! The kits!

The only real good thing of GRAW was that you could "make" your own weapon, adding a red dot, a foward grip, a silencer, or not. And I used to have my own pre-made kits; hallows always without red dot, for examples, while larger maps with it. Sometimes foward grip, sometimes no.

And i was expecting this for GRAW 2: more optics, for example, an Acog for large maps and a eotech for CQB, etc.

But...nothing.

More than half of the weaps have iron sights only.

But there is more. In graw i could go with my sniper rifle and a M8 compact on my back, or chosing between a silenced pistol or a MP5. Now, sniper only with pistol. No nades at all. Kit with nades only to a single class of soldiers.

Sincerly, i dont understand this. Why? To make game more balanced? Ok it can be! As far as i saw in the demo, there is no more that "artillery effect" made by ten player for each team throwing nades in all direction. But it seems crazy to me.

I still remember those 6 nades in Ghost Recon (the original!). And everyone used them, and were "disabled" only for lag reasons in server with 20+ players.

Maybe you want to ask me "what the hell you want then?" well, im gonna tell you what i was expecting...

I was expecting some class of soldiers like you did, but instead of kits, maybe with different primary weapons only (weapon with GL only to demolitions, like u did, MGs only to support, etc) but a totally "freedom" in chosing secodary weapon/extra like mags or nades or smokes. Maybe sniper class that could change a few optics on their rilfles...why not using an acog on that M14?

In the end, this are the only real "critics" i can make. I've seen many improvements from graw 1, graphics looks gr8, uniforms of the teams are now balanced (in GRAW 1 USA team was really too bright), gr8 the introduction of the red dot when you hit (many swearing less! ), and the new game mode is very interesting. And thanks to give us back that Map

I know you cannot change a game for a post by an anonimous player, i dont want that. But i would like an answer to my comments.

Thanks, and, have a good dat.

Gabriele / PGS_Killabees

[Evilducky]

The single player will have a free kit choice, but I dont think the mp side will have to much of a choice in there guns..

[CSF_DeadManWalking]

The single player will have a free kit choice, but I dont think the mp side will have to much of a choice in there guns..

TOO BAD!!! I totally agree with my italian friend Killabees: thumbs down for "prefab kits"!!!!

[philkilla]

I miss making my own kits too.

It adds much more versatility to the MP side.

[chilly-willy]

pre-fab kits does seem silly.

[Brok21k]

I think the kits are there to help keep the game as tactical and as teambased as possible. It forces your team members to select different kits inorder to forfill every strategic option. They have also limited the range of some assault rifles forcing support of a fellow sniper. Such as scar H, which is nolonger as effective at long range but is extremely powerful upclose. I think its cleverly and realisticly balanced the kits. Saying that, I would prefer to pick what I want inorder to improve my game. But it isnt graw1, its a new game, and it requires you to re-master the weapons, this may be difficult at first but highly enjoyable. I suggest you practice with each weapon, until you find the one best suited to your playing style. Remember you always can pick up a weapon.

Edited June 15, 2007 by Brok21k

[sgt.hoot]

well heres a solution mess wiht the xmls and change like "assigned gun="m8" to like assigned gun="scar_l" whatever the code is but i will look into it when the retail comes out there are no non anti cheat servers yet but i will look in to it for u guys so even if theyre kits u can still make ur OWN prefab kits, the best we can do (so far)

[Brok21k]

well heres a solution mess wiht the xmls and change like "assigned gun="m8" to like assigned gun="scar_l" whatever the code is but i will look into it when the retail comes out there are no non anti cheat servers yet but i will look in to it for u guys so even if theyre kits u can still make ur OWN prefab kits, the best we can do (so far)

I guess anti cheat will be watching the bundle files only. If you can change kits, it would be real easy to make a GUI kit changer in Flash. Maybe you should make a fresh post asking GRIN if changing the kit XML is considered as cheating.

[ita_killabees]

hmm i hope it is! or if u can make ur own kit, well, its a bit ridicolous! what about if u can run for the maps with a scar/h+gl and a sniper rifle? seems a bit crazy!

btw that's not the point; i opened this thread cuz i think that having weapons that u can adjust basing on the situation was pretty better that being forced to test kits and kits to find the right one.

to me, each map in graw had its 2/3 possible kits, with/without dot, with/without silencer, all based on the situation, the map, the role i was gonna play with my clan. And i enjoyed that.

[reLapse]

Maybe you should make a fresh post asking GRIN if changing the kit XML is considered as cheating.

I would be very surprised if they said they don't consider it cheating as the options are practically limitless.

I for one like not seeing snipers running around with mp5 or equivalent as a backup.

[Brok21k]

Maybe you should make a fresh post asking GRIN if changing the kit XML is considered as cheating.

I would be very surprised if they said they don't consider it cheating as the options are practically limitless.

I for one like not seeing snipers running around with mp5 or equivalent as a backup.

Well if their were limitations like max weight (same as graw 1 but more strick) that would make things more fair. But I do agree, it is practically limitless (i also hated sniper with mp5). But if the anti-cheat dosen't catch this mod, then it will become standard.

[Cangaroo.TNT]

Yes you can have custom kits, but I think they are assigned when you make a map. In otherwords, I think the kits & restrictions are map-specific and not controlled by the server or client. So, I think you can only pick a kit that a map maker has created. That way, if someone wants to make a pistols only map, they can.

I think servers will be able to restrict certain weapons, regardless of how the map maker creates kits, but I don't think you'll be able to pick anything from the complete weapon inventory.

[TheVoodoo]

IMO its a good thing to have those kits! Because its well balanced and stops nadespamming all the way that ruined the GRAW MP experience. You have to earn better ranks to access better kits.

I mean who would not put a scope and a GL on his weapon if that would be possible?

Its great that we are restricted to use standard arms at the beginning, so they get a usage ingame.

Edited June 15, 2007 by TheVoodoo

[Nutlink]

Yes you can have custom kits, but I think they are assigned when you make a map. In otherwords, I think the kits & restrictions are map-specific and not controlled by the server or client. So, I think you can only pick a kit that a map maker has created. That way, if someone wants to make a pistols only map, they can.

I think servers will be able to restrict certain weapons, regardless of how the map maker creates kits, but I don't think you'll be able to pick anything from the complete weapon inventory.

I'm pretty sure I've heard this too. If I recall there are some Coop maps where there is a kit that has a ZEUS, while maps that don't require it won't have that kit. If that's the case, I'm looking forward to some SMG/Pistol maps.

[Clone_Ranger]

I miss the ability to easily add new weapons to Ghost Recon...

I know it's a lot harder to do now because of the beautify weapons animations that we have now - but I remember with fondness the HUGE amount of new weapons that used to be churned out for the original GR! (Even though you couldn't really see them! LOL)

What does every one else think about this - ?

I tell you why I miss it - because GRAW2 looks like it doesn't have two of my favorite current rifles in it - the 6.5mm Grendal and the 7.62mm DSA-58OSW (FN FAL Tactical).

Sorry if I'm moaning for no good reason - just being a bit sentimental about things past!

Given the choice I would choose the fantastic weapons models we have enjoyed since GRAW...

But it's always nice to fiddle around with new hardware and have a weapon that's a bit different from everyone else!

[Merged into an existing thread]

Edited June 18, 2007 by Pave Low

[ita_killabees]

IMO its a good thing to have those kits! Because its well balanced and stops nadespamming all the way that ruined the GRAW MP experience. You have to earn better ranks to access better kits.

I mean who would not put a scope and a GL on his weapon if that would be possible?

Its great that we are restricted to use standard arms at the beginning, so they get a usage ingame.

I did. I used to not use scope and silencer on scar-h, while i used on the M8.

And, what about those snipers with mp5 u talk about?

Two things to say: first, not all sniper were good snipers (ive seen CRAZY things in multi, but gr8 videos on youtube too), second, a compact m8 or an mp5 isn't that great support, expecially because in a 1vs1, one die and one survive, ALWAYS. And these two weapons were so less accurate and less powerfull that i always used to take a pistol. Usually i died in a 1vs1, yeah, but u know the satisfaction of killing a guy with a scar-h and u with a m9 in hallows???

Vodoo, u talked about spawnnading. For that there is only a solution. BAN. U say it once, then twice, then ban. We probably have the biggest ban list in GRAW. But we do no care. Why take out nades only for a couple of noobs that have to nade the spawn to feel like a champion?

And, as far as i remember, in [Ghost Recon] spawn killing was a sort of routine. In each map there were the key position to close enemy spawn. Still remember that. And NOBODY has never tried to say "spawnkiller" to someone else. That was the game. Cmon people, dont tell me u never slaughtered the blue team in M05 Embassy why coming out of that garage!!!

[ADB5]

I need to agree with all of this, the premade kits are one of the only negative parts of the game so far, it slightly gets on my nerve...

[huddex]

I agree, premade kits is annoying and does not add to the game in a possitve way.

[Nutlink]

Premade kits aren't going to be in every game mode. In SP, for example, you'll be able to put your weapon together the way you want like GRAW 1. Besides, it might end up being a server option, and if it isn't it might be possible to script a custom TDM game type that allows for customizable weapons. That, and kits can vary from map to map thanks to the scripting, so we'll see what finally happens.

[tauri123]

as long as i can choose my own kit for sp and coop im happy wit the preset layouts. for me, they are very balanced an no class is overpowered (just my opinion).

these kits remind me a bit to raven shield. in mp you only could add one special to your weapon (scope, silencer and so on). i "think" the same idea was behind creating these kits.

[Cangaroo.TNT]

Well, for cying out loud, there are 41 kits in TDM.

EDIT:

12 - Demolitions

12 - Rifleman

12 - Assault

2 - Support

3 - Sniper

Edited June 19, 2007 by Cangaroo.TNT

[Gascogne]

It would have been more fun with custom kits like Rainbow 6 Vegas at or atleast to a degree.

But it can always changed with a patch if we want it bad enough.

[GHOST_Sup]

All I know is that I'll be playing on the servers that ban nade launchers. Can't stand them!

[ita_killabees]

a restriction that put 1 or 2 grenade launcher for each team would be much more interesting! when there are 5vs5 all with GL, its rare to hear a shot! lol

seriously, special classes like GL and maybe sniper could be "limited" to a restricted number, like in america's army.

[WhiteKnight77]

I really like the idea to restrict one GL to a team. Set it up so the person also only gets 6 shots with it and it just might keep the 'nade spam deaths at a minimum.