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What anoys me the most is that there is no lobby like [GR] had You can't go in the server to change anything.

You must start up a server and have limited server settings. I can't even set the number of players allowed. When you want to change anything you have quit and restart that annoys me.

I don't believe that will be the case in the final version.
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when i was playing RvSA i died (as usual) and was in deathcam, so i scroll throgh some of my teammates and one of em was runnin in 3rd person!!!!!!!! any1 else seen this?

Edited by sgt.hoot
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The weapons at the 2-3 star level are fantastic! Why, oh why do you we not have the option to pick and choose our rifles in the MP (outside of choosing a different class all together) ?

Just to be sure...

Romulus, when you enter the TDM load page, you can see three classes of soldiers, at the bottom of each is a number 1 with bars on the left and the right. Click on those bars and it changes which weapon you want for each class. I think theres about 16 kits in each??

In RvS you have to work your way up through levels to get different guns and kits.

Yeah, but not in RvS...which I think is a very strong mode!!! I love the game play and look forward to plenty of laddering!!!

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Something new for today and yesterday: I can't pick up all kinds of weapons. It seems that I only can pick up class specific weapons. The day before yesterday and before I could pick up RX4 with GL as scrambler or scout but now the M14 for example seems impossible to pick up with those classes.

Is this some change done server side which we don't know about?

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The game needs a spectate mode for people that are afk. playing on one of the official servers last night and there was 1 guy on alpha team that was afk but the game kept bringing him in with the active players. We were getting our butts handed to us and inevitably this guy was the last man every round of every map. My clan mate and I tried to vote kick him but it never passed,as a result the agony continued. I was on that server for 90 minutes to 2 hours and this fellow was afk the entire time ....would some sort of spec mode unless you ready up be the answer I think so .

okay rant over

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When i joined these forums a couple of months ago everyone was waiting for GRAW to be released. First the demo came out and then some time after that the full release. I was very disapointed with the game. Performance was poor, graphics where poor, multiplayer was poor etc. I left the forums and the whole Ghost Recon community. Now months later i'm back. The Ghost Recon 2 demo was released last week and i though i'd give it a try on my new computer.

I was right on months back when i didnt like the game, so now i have to be honest too. GRIN, you did an amazing job this time. The game has improved drastically. First off, you did something for those awfull jaggy's GRAW had. I don't know what you did, but i like it. Second, the multiplayer. This is real fun! The map is very good, weapons are balanced correctly and this time it keeps me interested.

There is still some things that need to be fixed, but a good solid base is there! I'm really excited this time and i want to compliment you guys for doing an amazing job. :thumbsup:

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First, the Demo is very well done. From an MP only player, it is a 180 degree turn from GRAW 1. Nicely done Bo and company.

I do not like the restrictions in RvA for the classes( at least give each class two options per class to start) but I do like the objective element, very nice...that said, I am wondering if there is info regarding Siege and Hamhill. I think I recall a Grinner saying that one of those modes would not have weapons restricted?

Again, well done on the DEMO.

Semper Fi,

Romulus

Edited by Romulus_45acp
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OK folks, here it is. From everything I've read so far it sounds as if GRAWW2 is just a big map pack for GRAW. The widescreen issues seem to have gone a step in reverse. the prone firing problems are still there. The sound is still apparently louder than need be for all things that might give away one's position (though, as before, the sound guru for this game did a killer job of making believeable and immersive sounds, and really ought to take a few weeks off to make a sound mod fo ArmA). Et cetera.

As for SP, of course there's little to be known. Will the missions be linear as they were in GRAW? Likely. Will the script be bugged (think of the grenade launcher guy in VIP 2 is Down mission that you could bypass but weren't supposed to... wouldn't let you cross Angel Plaza until you went back and killed him)? Sure. Will kit selection be disappointing? Hard to tell yet.

What I'm asking is, is any of the above wrong? Is GRAW2 going to be equal to or better than the sum of its parts (excellent weapon and character modelling, great sound, etc.) or will the UbiShaft curse cause it to fall flat on it's fourth point of contact?

Will it be improved enough that I would take back my word to never purchase another Ubishaft title to give the venerable GR name one last shot, or is it proof that I should have been in OFP all along and that ArmA is where my path lies?

Y'all tell me. Because I'm not gonna WASTE $60 to find out the hard way AGAIN. I love the GRiN bunch, despite the criticisms of my fellow players, but GRAW didn't deserve the G and R, largely due to UbiShaft's influence I feel. Does GRAW2?

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the sound guru for this game did a killer job of making believeable and immersive sounds, and really ought to take a few weeks off to make a sound mod fo ArmA

:yes:

____

Sad to say but based solely on the contents (and direction) of the beta and demo, I think your footgear is safe from consumption.

Will SP be substantially different from either the previous version or the current (play balancing) route of the new MP...doubtful.

Had high hopes.

____

Stay safe!

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Will it be improved enough that I would take back my word to never purchase another Ubishaft title to give the venerable GR name one last shot, or is it proof that I should have been in OFP all along and that ArmA is where my path lies?

Y'all tell me. Because I'm not gonna WASTE $60 to find out the hard way AGAIN.

This logic is flawed IMHO. You cannot replace the GRAW experience with ArmA. GRAW1 was what it was. And for me, it was a blast. Especially in COOP. Have you played Coop ArmA yet? That AI is totally different than the enemy AI of GRAW. The controls are also vastly different. The whole thing is different. And the Maps are so large that organized teams are hard to come by. Even on the so called "Organized Squad servers".

I enjoy Arma. And I enjoyed GRAW1. Assuming they fix the Widescreen, I will likely buy and enjoy GRAW2. But to assume that you can exchange the type of fun extracted from one for the other (or worse, to assume you can get GR1 play out of ArmA) just isn't so.

At least not in my opinion.

Edited by Sleepdoc
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OK folks, here it is. From everything I've read so far it sounds as if GRAWW2 is just a big map pack for GRAW. The widescreen issues seem to have gone a step in reverse. the prone firing problems are still there. The sound is still apparently louder than need be for all things that might give away one's position (though, as before, the sound guru for this game did a killer job of making believeable and immersive sounds, and really ought to take a few weeks off to make a sound mod fo ArmA). Et cetera.

As for SP, of course there's little to be known. Will the missions be linear as they were in GRAW? Likely. Will the script be bugged (think of the grenade launcher guy in VIP 2 is Down mission that you could bypass but weren't supposed to... wouldn't let you cross Angel Plaza until you went back and killed him)? Sure. Will kit selection be disappointing? Hard to tell yet.

What I'm asking is, is any of the above wrong? Is GRAW2 going to be equal to or better than the sum of its parts (excellent weapon and character modelling, great sound, etc.) or will the UbiShaft curse cause it to fall flat on it's fourth point of contact?

At least the assumption that GRAW2 is just a map pack for GRAW is totally wrong. And I guess you haven't read that much if "everything you read so far" points you in that direction. Most people in this forum - including die hard GRAW dislikers - witness that GRAW2 is something they like and probably will buy (WS issue seems to be the biggest FUBAR, but so it was with GRAW and GRIN did fix it).

When it comes to things which you can't judge from demo… hard to tell. But the overall impression from the demo is that GRIN have listened on the feedback made on GRAW so far, so one can presume that they would have done that for the rest of the game too.

For example you got at least 2 ROE now in SP, that is something.

But YMMV, you have to make up your own mind if the game is to your liking. But as you asked, many around here find it as something they will buy. Take care and greet any Swedes you find out there, from their Defense College.

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Dude, this game rock for MP...It has great action and the RvA is well done....the sound is amazing as are the gfx...

It's very polished.

Agreed, sound and graphics is one of the best things in GRAW I think. GRAW2 is going to be even better as evidence of the mp demo. SP and MP, GRAW pc rules and GRAW2 pc is going to rule even more. :yes:

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Well Rabbi, here's some answers (repeats of what some have already said)

MP Adversarial- The Good

-Character classes w/ multiple kits per class

-Reduced the number of grenades for the launcher and the number of hand grenades for the other classes (2 for the launcher, 1 hand nade)

-Camo actually works, and is better than the space crap we had before

-Kill notifications are separate from the chat box, so you see both much better

-Two players can kill each other at the same time with bullets

-Assault vs Recon game type is much better than Domination, and could actually be a hit when the game is released (more details on game mode in other thread)

-Semi Auto is actually the way to go if the enemy is more than 10-15 yards away, but full auto still works for CQB

-Players can use the stationary guns placed on the map

-Pistols are actually useful now that they do a fair amount of damage

-Pistols are pulled out rather quickly making them a better option to pull out than to reload at times, unlike GRAW 1

-Wide variety of weapons

-You can actually hide in bushes at people will run right past you, going hand in hand with the better camo

-You can pick up a fallen players weapon to replace your own or add to your collection

-GRAW 1 had 3 slots (Primary, Secondary, Accessory), while GRAW 2 has 4 slots (Primary, Secondary, Side Arm, Accessory)

-Ammo is somewhat limited, so no more running with 10 magazines for those SCARs

-Head shots mean much more than ever, even a Mk 45 will kill in 1 shot to the head, going hand in hand with semi auto on rifles as well

-This isn't confirmed yet, but I'm sure it'll be true, but more server options all around. Unsure what extra options, but I've seen things in the bundle that imply a fair amount

-Improved net code. I rarely see the run n kill anymore, but it's still there once in a while

-Mini map just like [GR]

-Grids on the maps, both mini map and HUD map

MP Adversarial - The Bad

-No selectable spawn points

-"Enemy Down" sound played when you kill an enemy (bad IMO, some like it though)

-Unknown yet, but it seems we're stuck with kits without the option to have a server allow customizable weapons like GRAW 1

-Dedicated servers and SADS are supposedly going to be available with the game, but unknown how reliable and stable they are going to be yet

-Cannot select which camo you want (comes with each kit instead)

-No ability to call out a spotted enemy to your teammates (except tagging in Assault vs Recon, but that's only for the Ghost team as well)

-Orange dot hit indicator for when your shot hits an enemy (some like it, I don't)

-Cannot create a squad like GRAW 1

Coop/SP - The Good

-Multiple drop points (at least in SP, unsure about Coop or Campaign Coop, also depends on the map)

-Campaign Coop is the same as before, 4 man squad, but no more game over on death of team leader and multiple spawns are allowed

-Quick save in SP (if you are not in combat)

-Coop (formerly [GR] Coop) will allow for objectives and much more scripting than what was available in GRAW 1

-Enemy AI is supposedly better, but unknown to what extent

-Can switch your teammates between Assault (everything goes) to Recon (use silenced weapons, be careful what they shoot at)

-Can order teammates to take out particular enemies (SP, unknown about either coop mode)

-Maps are going to supposedly be more open

-When ordering a teammate, you can see exactly where you ordered them to move to (unlike GRAW 1)

-In SP (unknown for either coop mode) you can command Mexican Loyalists as part of your squad (cannon fodder!)

-Multiple Ghosts to select from to form your squad

-Any Ghost can place C4, not just the squad lead

Coop/SP - The Bad

-Not all maps have multiple insertion points

-Some maps are still just linear from the looks, but there are supposedly going to be maps that will be "open" (like [GR])

-Stuck with a 4 man team in SP and Campaign Coop, but 12 (maybe more?) for Coop

Overall - The Good

-Custom maps will allow for custom kits for character classes, meaning you could have a map with nothing but pistols and SMGs or nothing but sniper rifles

-Instead of having 4 bundles for the same map for multiple game types, each map is 1 bundle that holds all the information needed for each game type

-Small day/night or night/day transitions on some maps

-Server can switch between game modes without having to restart

-Screen shot function implemented as part of the anti-cheat

-Supports dual core (not fully, but definitely a noticeable difference between dual and single core CPUs)

-Supports Ageia Physx again, and even has a special map for those with the Physx card (also a down side since not everyone has access to the map)

-Night vision looks way better than GRAW 1

-Much better weapon selection (Rx4, M14, MP5A4, M416, Mk 45, G36C, G36, HK21, MSG-90 all added to the original roster)

-Automatically detects, and if possible, uses SLI

-More graphic options for those on lower systems

Overall - The Bad

-Widescreen not properly supported (although this might change before release due to the complaints) * NOW FIXED ACCORDING TO STICKAN IN THE WS THREAD!

-While it plays differently than GRAW 1 (in a good way mostly), it feels like GRAW 1.75, or what GRAW 1 should have been

-Draw distance is still 147m (why oh why wasn't this a graphical option in the menus)

-Some bugs from GRAW 1 are still there, both pre- and post patch 1.35

While I am personally getting this game because I liked GRAW 1 and have loved the beta and the demo, if you are really on the fence with this one I suggest waiting until release to see how it is. I still recommend getting the game eventually though, even if you wait until it drops in price. Hope this helped, and I hope you read all of it :P

Edited by Nutlink
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Interesting points. I really liked the graphics in GRAW and the [GR] COOP. Glad to hear that they are incorporating the COOP again. However, I do really believe that they left GRAW out to dry. I find that disappointing. When this comes out, GRAW is done. This is one that I'll be waiting on to see how it all turns out. It will be interesting if there is a Dx10 version of GRAWX this time next year or if GRAW2 is patched to Dx10.

Also, comparing to ARMA just does not wash. ARMA is a military sim. GRAW is not. [GR] was a mil sim, especially in the COOP mode. One had to use real tactics to accomplish objectives. But trying to compare GRAW and ARMA, just doesn't cut it. Two different games/simulators that appeal to completely different audiences with a bit of cross over from both groups.

Edited by Sailindawg
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one other thing is that its not gonna BE $60 grin isnt the rip off artists that microsoft is that they charge for their 360 games, its gonna be a $50 dollar game lol

The development cost on consoles is higher (pound for pound) than it is on PCs.

Sadly, one reason is becuase PC's can ship with as many bugs as the publisher/developer is willing to risk against their reputation. This is not true on consoles. Console games must pass certain "tests" that the console makers (SONY/MS/Nintendo) set forth. And they have the sole right to 'fail" the game and send it back to the publisher/dev for more work. think about that. The dev is not done spending money and shipping until MS says they are done.

It costs more to develop on consoles, feature for feature.

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i havent read the dozens of pages but here is what i would like to see "changed" in GRAW 2 , as per the demo :

- while strafing there is a finite distance "notched" into your movement , there is no in-between in how little or much you can strafe , it is a fixed amount . i was hoping the duration of your key press would define how little or much you strafe , not a fixed amount in a digital way .

-on the RX-4 weapon system , there is a 2x red dot scope . the dot is far larger than on the 30 mm red dot scope found on the mp5 or g36 , and the objective lens is smaller than that of the 30 mm . im wondering why the scope is so small in objective lens size and why the dot is so big , its almost impossible to aim without alot of training ,and while i intend to train with GRAW 2 , i think the lens should be modified , and the dot made smaller . its just useless as it is now .

-throwing grenades is a tedious task as it is , since they have nearly the same weight and bounce properties of a smoke grenade can . this i think is just one of those things that are meant to be "good enough " to not put more work into . but a grenade bouncing off the ground in a huge arc as it leaves the ground is too wild for me to tolerate . please adjust the physical properties to make it heavier and less reactive .

-the premade kits have been discussed , but i am hoping that there will be an option to NOT use a scope if desired . the problem i face is that i use the scout or scrambler class that uses the mp5 , and i prefer to use the iron sights . i get far better accuracy due to the more controlled recoil , and using the red dot just makes the sight bounce up in a completely unrealistic way . the recoil in the red dot is a predefined animation and just doesnt suit the task , it acts as if im 13 and havent lifted more than 30 pounds in my life ... since the iron sights produce far less recoil but are limited to the post sights which are more difficult for new users , this is not a good tradeoff and looks extremely fake , and see through at that .

- a big problem ive seen dealing with people who have left their pc's during the game and are sitting in a remote corner so they wont be killed has to be dealt with . while i think there should be a way to tell the remaining players the status and position of an "afk'er" , the chat system should not be that method . people who play GRAW 2 fdo not all act appropriately . using the chat system some users banter and use extremely offensive means to put other players down , which would clearly violate any Terms Of Use that the developers would find approopriate , if they had indeed put one into action . theres needs to be a signal that can reveal the status and position of an afk'er , and i think that signal should be made to funtion only if the player has not moved in more than 30 second or a minute .

- the death cam is exploited far too often to warrant its use . with the chat being visible by anyone , even from the dead , this increases the "ghosting" that occurs . i realize using a communications program like teamspeak or ventrilo is another way of doing this , but you are making it even easier for someone who doesnt use comms to ghost to their team , effectively "cheating " the opposing forces out of chances to win . this serieously needs to be addressed .

"Ghosting" could be defined as - any manner in which a dead player acts as if he were alive and presents their team with intel that could not have been obtained unless remotely viewing , which is not possible in the game unless dead . [EDIT] the remote "tagging" of enemies should be enough , the chat should be limited to those who are alive . [EDIT]

auto-balance should also be an issue that is addressed ... the demo is full of cowardly team switching to try to win .

Edited by CTU_JackBauer
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one think I notice today was you cant hit ANYTHING beyond the draw distance.. I mean, I was following a guy up the hill to the B adat in the RvA game today, and was about to shoot him and he goes beyond the draw distance and it never hit him.. :( I had the m99 sniper rifle too, which are accuret up to a mile or more depending on weather and the shooter, but still.. that made me sad. I liked graw where you could see the guy beyond the draw distance by looking left and right, then shooting him down before you could actually see him.

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(Sorry - I know this is about the demo, but my remarks about teh general game quality as a whole.)

Had my first go with the demo, and even though it is just the demo I have to say I really enjoyed myself! (Oh - but I got my ass kicked big style!)

I can't be sure, but things feel more solid that GRAW1 - the graphics seem more efficient somehow, smoother at the same settings I had for GRAW1. Is that my imagination?

The maps included in the demo made me chuckle - did they remind anyone else of 'Ghost Town' from the [Ghost Recon]! All it was missing was that tin can being blow about in the wind. :)

The realism was terrific ( - I'm running a Nvidia 8800GTS -), in fact sometimes it was a little scarily realistic. I had a hard time concentrating on the game rather than eyeballing the eye candy (at least that's my excuse!)...

I was also pleased with the speed and ease of connection to servers over the internet. I had a lot of problems and wasn't happy with the online game interface and connection in GRAW1. But this time connection was fast and responsive and my game itself was really enjoyable (8 of us playing) and - I'm glad to say - lag free!

I had a very pleasant hour or twos gaming - the only down side is that I was playing without voice-comms which (IMHO) detracts from the atmosphere and efficiency of team play.

Based on this initial outing I have pre-purchased GRAW2.

I'm very please with the obvious tweaking that has gone on - it has created a lot better game, particularly in the area on online play. I look forward to my copy of the full game arriving, and working through the single player mission - and co-op should be a hoot.

I'm convinced that GRAW2 will finally get us 'back to basics' and please all those of us with very fond memories of the original game.

....Now - if only they had a 7.62mm L1A1 available I would be in heaven! LOL

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