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GRAW - Realism optimization mod


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The installer didnt change the language in context.xml, was it supposed to? If not you might consider telling the non technical people that in a 'final' release. Gonna go try this out now :o=:o=

Well the colors will take a little getting used to, but after turning my brightness way up I do like it. I was playing mission 2, and noticed that (from the map, couldnt see it from the ground) the roof of the palace thing by that big plaza had this wierd pink stripe down it. Not your fault though, I think its the map. Also the command map seemed to be quite a bit brighter than the first person view, but that may have been my monitor (a super old LCD).

I havent run any previous versions of this mod, so this may not be new, and I may be immagining it for that matter, but it seemed to me like the AI is now super zealous. If you tell them to move right on top of an enemy position they seem to select some cover right next to the position then move straight toward it. The sniper doesnt even shoot back much, he just runs for the cover. The rest of them fire while advancing, but in the end get killed too. Not sure if theres a fix for that, or again, I may be immagining it, but I think with a little readjustment on my part it wont be an issue.

Overall, I love it :thumbsup:

Edited by insane snyper
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As stated in the above posts, it is kind of dark until you reset brightness in the settings menu, after that, its great! The definition between objects seems clearer and the sky looks like sky. Have'nt run it long enough to really be able to see any difference in AI but they do seem to form up closer. I think you've got a keeper here, looking forward to the final version :thumbsup:

One thing you might want to tweak... I turned around to check on Allen and he appears to be wearing lipstick... which I think is still out of uniform!

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Yeah his lips are quite pink.

They are pink? :blink:

does it change much in performance ?

as i have seen SS and saw the skins are they heavier and are other things heavier on the computing ?

just wondering...

I don't think something is heavier on the computing because the mod deactivates a lot of things, so you should rather see a increase in performance. Yes the skins are a but different but that doesn't mean they are "heavier" than before! ;)

The installer didnt change the language in context.xml, was it supposed to? If not you might consider telling the non technical people that in a 'final' release. Gonna go try this out now :o=

No, it wasn't supposed to change the language in the context.xml but yes, I'll include that in the next readme! :)
If you tell them to move right on top of an enemy position they seem to select some cover right next to the position then move straight toward it.
As stated in the readme they're on defensive mode, which means they will only attack if you order them to attack (via cross com / tactical map) but unless they are detected by enemy forces and get under fire, they won't shoot at all and instead search for the nearest and safest cover (stealth).
The sniper doesnt even shoot back much, he just runs for the cover.
All of them won't shoot on sight because that would give away their position, but they will return fire if someone attacks them.
The rest of them fire while advancing, but in the end get killed too.
Are you sure the mod is correctly installed and which difficulty setting are you using? :huh: Edited by Vth_F_Smith
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Ok, I just ran side by side (actually end to end if you want to get really technical) tests with and without the mod. Basically I loaded up mission 2, selected ghost team, and told them to move right into the middle of that bunch of enemies out in the street.

The difference was definetly noticeable, but not huge. Without the mod they basically advanced on the enemy position, and (somewhat unrealistically) overran it with a head on attack. The sniper's health decreased by one level, everyone else was unhurt.

With the mod they began advancing down the street. Pretty immediately the enemies opened up on them and they took cover in the little doorways and whatnot. They were still advancing, but under more cover. Good news so far. By this time they are were getting up toward the intersection, and had taken out a few of the tangos up by the cars. As soon as all the enemis stopped shooting for a second or so all my chaps took off out into the intersection, where they were promptly shot by the guys down the road to the east, then the guys at the cars popped back up and shot them some more. They did manage to overrun the enemies at the cars, but this time the SAW guy was hit pretty bad, and the sniper was down one health again.

But aside from my 'scientific' testing, I've played a few missions with the mod, and found that as long as you dont give such suicidal orders, and actually design your orders with cover in mind your guys are actually much better. My assessment is that the mod is fine, it just requires a little different style of play to get the full benefit of it.

Great work, I'm running this mod whenever I play sp! :thumbsup: (havent played any coop yet)

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Just ran thru Guardrail IX and was unable to deactivate the cross-com feed from the drone, no biggie but did not happen prior to this mod, (at least I did'nt notice it). Muzzle-flash seems to be more pronounced in low light conditions.

The grass is greener with this mod...no really, it is!

EDIT: Hope you're able to add your version of the HUD!

Edited by noquarter
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But aside from my 'scientific' testing, I've played a few missions with the mod, and found that as long as you dont give such suicidal orders, and actually design your orders with cover in mind your guys are actually much better. My assessment is that the mod is fine, it just requires a little different style of play to get the full benefit of it.

Great work, I'm running this mod whenever I play sp! :thumbsup: (havent played any coop yet)

Thats basicly what my stratage always was. Cuz often I found my team standing out in the open just asking to get shot in the forehead, :snipe: But I think this mod decreases the need for a saw gunner.I still like watching brown mow mexicans down with his SAW though. :support::gun::FIREdevil:

hey sweet, im 2nd class now :)

Edited by Commander Outcast
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Any update, Vth_F_Smith, long time no hear?

Just ran thru Guardrail IX and was unable to deactivate the cross-com feed from the drone, no biggie but did not happen prior to this mod, (at least I did'nt notice it).

I think I can chock this up to a program running in the background and that it was unrelated to your mod!

:thumbsup:

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I want to thank you for all your work...and being at the front of the GRAW mod scene..

But what the heck is on that guys lip?

HACK

Hmmm could be that my LCD doesn't display some colors right because it didn't look purple here but then again, I haven't heard any comments from someone related to that...strange! :huh:
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I want to thank you for all your work...and being at the front of the GRAW mod scene..

But what the heck is on that guys lip?

HACK

Hmmm could be that my LCD doesn't display some colors right because it didn't look purple here but then again, I haven't heard any comments from someone related to that...strange! :huh:

On my screen....looks like the guy has an STD on his upper lip.

HACK

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Got around to testing this and I must say it toned down the firefights.. alot. Now instead of wasting ammo, teammates actually fire burst and have dropped targets alot quicker. Used to be "spray and pray, might hit something someday" Now I can actually feel somewhat confident in a firefight and without having to hear "Captain I have to reload" all the time against one tango. It just amazed me a few times that they unload everything and can't hit one dude without me having to always jump in with a quick double tap or controlled pair. Well least the first mission test, more to come, but I like it so far :)

Edited by EricJ
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One thing I've noticed in the vanilla game, especially in MP but also in SP is that 'semi-auto' fire is ridiculously inaccurate. At the ranges encountered in this game, even the rare long alleys where you'll rarely/never engage a target most of the weapons in this game would be dead, nail driver accurate firing single shot -- even standing.

That the rifles have an effective pattern that more closely resembles a shotgun at 50+ yards than a rifle or SMG firing single shots is absurd as far as realism and discourages realistic marksmanship, manuver, cover and fire tactical play. There's way too much 'Rambo' run, gun and spray play in MP, and the same works far too well in SP...

In most of the mods I've worked on we've made at least all rifles 'pin-point' accurate at intermediate stances like crouching, with improved accuracy in sustained rapid fire when prone. You'd be astonished to see what a game engine will do to a code wise ideal or 'perfectly accurate' weapon; add the idiosyncrasies of the mouse interface and even with code perfect accuracy the weapon will have inaccuracies well above and beyond scale of the rest fo the game as far as real weapon accuracy is concerned.

Just something to think about if you want realistically performing weapons rather then just intuitively realistic weapon script metrics that don't pan out in-game. Real world elite force combat is not a spam fest of incessant full-auto, or even constant burst spray like vanilla GRAW -- in the real world precision aimed fire by trained and cool operatives is vastly more effective and the perferred MO...

sadeyes.gif

Edited by Waika
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I don't have a "issue with semi"; it's fine if you like action realism/arcade weapon metrics -- and obviously a lot of people do... But in the real world I can steady and fire a 7.62 or 5.56 rifle standing and more accurately hit targets at twice the distances available in GRAW then I can fire a weapon in GRAW prone just doing target practice, at intermediate distances where one should be able to be very accurate with a just a pistol.

My game test setup is prone, firing with both ironsigts and scope, with 7.62, 5.56, and 9mm ammunition using all weapons, giving plenty of time to recover from each shot, steady the weapon, and bring the sights to exact aim on a precise static target. Few real weapons could fire this inaccurately given these conditions, at these limited distances.

sadeyes.gif

Edited by Waika
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You ever do CQM? Close Quarters Marksmanship?

If then, you'd realize that you have no basis of what you're talking about. I've done it and can say you have to stabilize yourself against something to achieve pinpoint accuracy on semi. Even a controlled pair will still drift, when you're wearing body armor, you gotta go to the bathroom, it's hot as hell out, you've got adrenaline running through your body. Even at a 25m pistol target you're going to drift all over the target, and most of the time won't be in the same spot, and that's with an M68. It will still happen with any high speed reflex sight, or any other optic. Unless you really stay in a position yeah I agree, but CQM/CQB isn't about taking your time, it's accurate fire quickly ad and rapidly, and on target. Sure you'll miss with a few rounds, but that's expected when in an urban fight. It sounds all nice and pretty, but real life is how pretty much the game is.

Edited by EricJ
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The answer to your question is "yes", but your post is incorrect as you completely miss the point I was making which is: absolute weapon inaccuracy in GRAW is absurdly high using static prone and kneeling fire positions and static targets as the benchmark.

The game forces a default weapon inaccuracy (you can see this for a fact in the weapon script) that is not at all to scale or realistic. A real rifle fired in the same manner at the intermediate and longest ranges available in GRAW from these postures would be orders of magnitude more accurate even in modestly capable hands. That's a fact you may wish to dispute but can easily be proven as we can do the math of range firing equivalent weapons and MOA delta for the same distances in GRAW with GRAW weapons.

The unfortunate aspect that most GRAW combat is in fact CQC/B combat is largely a separate issue; the fact that the GRAW weapons are so inaccurate they don't allow for the option or effective, ranged, semi-automatic fire where that would realistically be an effective alternative in some of the mission scenarios is...

sadeyes.gif

Edited by Waika
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@Vth_F_Smith: Were you ever able to find a value (or set of values) that would cause the AI to assume a prone postion...the only time I see them in one is after a dive, and then they just get back up.

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No you need to spend some time at the range or go to Iraq, and tell me different. Now back on topic..

With ridiculous, below the basement, smart ass remarks like that which have absolutely no bearing on the facts of the discussion, combined with the fact that you don't respond to the facts or discussion regarding GRAW's weapon metrics and real world static weapon accuracy -- it's obvious you: bogusly represent your credentials, don't know what you're talking about, aren't reading anything but what you're writing, and/or most likely all the aforesaid...

Perhaps you just aren't reading for meaning or understanding and just didn't get the point which is, simply: the static accuracy of the GRAW rifles and SMGs is very low and not to scale. This has nothing to do with CQC, dynamic tactics or even marksmanship, dynamic range experience, your or my military experience, or your bad manners...

sadeyes.gif

Edited by Waika
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