ROCO*AFZ* Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 (edited) This is a flame nor a rant. Just an observation. When xbox got GR2, what did the community do? We DEMANDED GR released finished or not... Now roll to present day... xbox version of GRAW was finished and the community spoke again... give us GRAW PC we don't care if it's finished or not. This time GRIN delivered. We got what we wanted. A playable, but not finished game. And now what are we doing? Complaining becaues we got what we wanted. Enjoy it, and help them make a better game out of it people. They are patching it, but you have to understand... it wasn't completed and they released it so we would have SOMETHING at least. You complain and rant about your 50$. Well your 50$ is actually doing something. Supporting the development of a game. That is far better then buying something that is finished and will be shelved in a month because of no patching or no input. You can tell by the 1st patch that guess what? THEY ARE LISTENING to what needs fixed. I am an MP player but you know what? I can understand why it wasn't finished 1st. It requires the MOST testing, to balance gameplay, experience, and netcode. They threw us a gametype to see how it would act in a real environment. With all of us testing it i would imagine in the next patch or 2 we are going to have a GREAT game. You all forget how buggy GR1 was in demo and launch. Let me refresh you. 1) Servers crashed when over 12 people playing MP on the demo and 1st patch. GRAW is doing 25+ with no lag. Also did not work very good in NT based netcode/resources (2000/XP)over windows 98 2) in GR1 if you shot a sensor or claymore the game crashed. This was patched later. 3) m136 was an instant reload, back then i was the rocket man LOL 4) As a sniper you could switch to pistol and back and auto center your ret Now for what never got patched in GR1 5) Edge glitching... GRAW made sure this wasn't possible 6) Tiptoeing impossible to do without being able to be hit in GRAW 7) Left Peeking. Impossible in GRAW due to view being centered. In GR1 it was over the left eye so when you peeked left less of you was visible and right = more of you sticking out. 8) Weapons would stick through corners and walls. GRIN again made sure this couldn't happen. weapon goes up till you move back 9) GR1 had an outrageous server requirement of 16mb card. (THAT WAS EXTREMELY HIGH BACK THEN) And never had dedicated servers (modders made reconlog and others) Don't get me wrong GR1 was a great game, but only after numerous patches and fixes. How about we give GRAW that same chance? If 3 to 4 patches down the road it ain't a great game then complain until then... we have exactly what GR1 was, and what we wanted... an unfinished still developing by community input, but still playable game. Edited May 13, 2006 by ROCOAFZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prodigy Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 Nice post, I definately agree! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trident-za Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 Agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROCO*AFZ* Posted May 13, 2006 Author Share Posted May 13, 2006 (edited) thanks mano. People are comparing GRAW to what GR1 developed into, not how it started. i was playing during the GR1 demo so i know what it was like LOL! it wasn't fun. At the time we compared it to finished game DFLW I guess what people need to do is uninstall ghost recon, go find the ORIGINAL demo and try it. I'm betting they won't like it. Edited May 13, 2006 by ROCOAFZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 Some good points, I would like to add that also this game is pushing the envelope on technology like no other game, this can also can cause various problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROCO*AFZ* Posted May 13, 2006 Author Share Posted May 13, 2006 (edited) Some good points, I would like to add that also this game is pushing the envelope on technology like no other game, this can also can cause various problems. Agreed as was GR1... remember the 1st time you turned eax on in GR1 when you had a card that supported it? GRAW uses eax 3.0., turn eax off untill they patch it and sound issues go away and remember when you got new hardware and upped the settings in GR1? it was pushing the envelope in may of 2001 when the demo released. patches fixed issues and new hardware also. (remember the voodoo card issues with fuzzy fonts and such?) Edited May 13, 2006 by ROCOAFZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metal_Jacket Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 Well said Roco. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REC0N Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 The problem is we didnt get a new Ghost Recon, we got a complete diffrent game whit the name Ghost Recon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROCO*AFZ* Posted May 13, 2006 Author Share Posted May 13, 2006 (edited) The problem is we didnt get a new Ghost Recon, we got a complete diffrent game whit the name Ghost Recon. Note what never got patched in GR1... due to these issues, it's not possible without redoing the whole game ... aka GRAW. The new Ghost Recon we already got... aka Frostbite, HX5 and anything else modders made ...and did any of you play the actual new GR1... Sum of all fears? We have been down that road before. It wasn't pretty. Edited May 13, 2006 by ROCOAFZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonehead Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 Cheers amigo, well said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REC0N Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 The problem is we didnt get a new Ghost Recon, we got a complete diffrent game whit the name Ghost Recon. Note what never got patched in GR1... due to these issues, it's not possible without redoing the whole game ... aka GRAW. The new Ghost Recon we already got... aka Frostbite, HX5 and anything else modders made. This was as far as the engine could go without a New game. Lots of the features that made us love Ghost Recon, is not in Ghost Recon Advanced Warfigter. Therefore its not worthy of its name, because its not Ghost Recon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROCO*AFZ* Posted May 13, 2006 Author Share Posted May 13, 2006 (edited) Lots of the features that made us love Ghost Recon, is not in Ghost Recon Advanced Warfigter. Therefore its not worthy of its name, because its not Ghost Recon Note it's not called Ghost Recon 3... meaning it's not an addition to the same engine. Advanced Warfighter means based off the same topic, but in the future (as in using the pc's cutting edge technology) And just so you all know i do agree it needs work, but good work takes time and input on what works and what doesn't. Major problems 1st. minors sort out over time. Edited May 13, 2006 by ROCOAFZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prodigy Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 I guess you would want it from Red Storm then Recon? If it was from Red Storm, it would've been a port just like every other game now, like Lockdown, and Call of Duty 2. I believe we all know what happened with Lockdown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viiiper Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 (edited) Don't get me wrong GR1 was a great game, but only after numerous patches and fixes. How about we give GRAW that same chance? If 3 to 4 patches down the road it ain't a great game then complain until then... we have exactly what GR1 was, and what we wanted... an unfinished still developing by community input, but still playable game. What your forgetting ROCOAFZ is that GRIN KNEW THE PROBLEMS GR1 HAD and were developing with HINSIGHT !!! SO WE EXPECTED IT NOT TO HAVE THE GR1 ISSUES from the start !!!! As much as i agree with you that we will get the GR3 [GRAW] we expected by PATCH 1.6 what you failed to mention is the fact that GRIN [no offence] KNEW the TASK KNEW the GOAL and knew the problems to AVOID [re GR1 !!! patching of game play and bugs]. WHERE GRIN went wrong was NOT RELEASING A MP DEMO !!! say 10 weeks before FINAL RELEASE !!!! THEN WE COULD HAVE FED BACK the GAME PLAY PROBLEMS and the things we are now complaining about !! ALL in ALL This level of moaning and complaints is about expected... STILL I do enjoy this next generation GR it's got possibilities and I commend GRIN for the GRAPHICS !!! The colour pallet and detail is GREAT .. I do run in 1920x1200 and it's great .. I don't miss AA and like the dynamic lighting ... Well done GRIN even with all the complaints best regards viii Edited May 13, 2006 by viiiper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REC0N Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 What I BASACLY would have wanted in a new Ghost Recon, is Ghost Recon whit a new graphic engine, first person weapon view and even further expanded realism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trident-za Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 What I BASACLY would have wanted in a new Ghost Recon, is Ghost Recon whit a new graphic engine, first person weapon view and even further expanded realism. I'm think that's pretty much what I got I got first person weapon view, a new engine and expanded realism. The setting is far more urban than GR1, but I can live with that. Once the MP side of things is fixed up, and mod tools are available this game will be even better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d0youlikecheese Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 The one thing im starting to notice is more people being Jerks and doing alot of team killing and the kick teamkills does not work had a guy in the server with 43 team kills and there nothing to do about it.. So with this in mind how long are people gonna wait, till they decide that this game isnt fun anymore, because of these people.. Plus the fact that hacks have already been implemented befor any server command are even announced.. But yeah game is fun.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROCO*AFZ* Posted May 13, 2006 Author Share Posted May 13, 2006 What your forgetting ROCOAFZ is that GRIN KNEW THE PROBLEMS GR1 HAD and were developing with HINSIGHT !!! SO WE EXPECTED IT NOT TO HAVE THE GR1 ISSUES from the start !!!! Note in my list og GR1 problems Grin avoided that GR1 had. They actually did avoid the GR1 problems. Now with that being said a new engine introduces new problems which are being worked on.. They did also do beta testing with a few clans to try to get it stable as possible before release, but remember they are on a schedule. UBI set the date and we were demanding. The june patch i bet will have the fixes for the demo issues + issues beta testers had with a few for new arrise problems and some additional things that aren't fixes. I bet the next patch (not the june)after that we will expect to see any new issues that arrive patched and final resolution to some of the released issues They also released an intermediate patch early. That shows a difference from GR1 as they didn't release patches until expansions with GR1 (released patch at same time as the expansion with patch) On a good note with the patch releases, it makes us go outside for the summer and with it all patched by winter we will be having a blast indoors when it's cold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papa6 Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 Alot of anger can be solved if you look at my thread yesterday about hardware see that Here Roco that was a VERY mature post mate. damn good job on it. very thoughtful too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REC0N Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 (edited) What I BASACLY would have wanted in a new Ghost Recon, is Ghost Recon whit a new graphic engine, first person weapon view and even further expanded realism. I'm think that's pretty much what I got I got first person weapon view, a new engine and expanded realism. The setting is far more urban than GR1, but I can live with that. Once the MP side of things is fixed up, and mod tools are available this game will be even better. Hmm no it doenst feel or look like Ghost Recon, it has that console feeling over it. As for the "expanded realism", I only have to say three things.. no injury effect (no gimp or worser aim), no "oneshot, one kill" (you can take three hits! even one in the face whit out dying) and no blood at all (only a little splash when a bullet hit a body). Edited May 13, 2006 by REC0N Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raymax Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 Well said! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viiiper Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 (edited) They also released an intermediate patch early. That shows a difference from GR1 as they didn't release patches until expansions with GR1 (released patch at same time as the expansion with patch) On a good note with the patch releases, it makes us go outside for the summer and with it all patched by winter we will be having a blast indoors when it's cold. LOL your a hard one to convince..... I do agree with the last para... WE WILL GET A SUMMER OUTSIDE !!! and i pray WE GET AN AUTUM / WINTER OF GR3 FUN GRIN had a schedule and Ubi set a release date !!! BUT THE RELEASE SLIPPED and SLIPPED and SLIPPED.. we were lucky to get it MAY 2006... WHAT I BASICALLY SAID IS; GRIN DESERVE THE CRITIZEMS !!! AND GRIN DESERVE THE COMENDATION/ PRAISE for the final product.... BUT THEY with UBI made the situation what it is by NOT RELEASING A GENERAL MP DEMO TO US !!! NOT SOME SPECIAL FEW !!!!!!! which DID NOT SORT OUT THESE MAJOR BASIC ISSUES we have NOW... GAMEPLAY WAS SET IN STONE WITH the FINAL v1.4 GR1 FACT ?? YES GAMEPLAY IN THE GR3 [GRAW] RELEASE IS SET IN POOH !! FACT ?? YES YOU CAN't disagree with that... I GIVE YOU THE BUGS ISSUE ARE NOT GR1 with the new engine and coding.. [complicated and expected] but screwing up the game play basics... YOU DISAGREE ?? well of course but it's fact as others have mentioned THIS IS NOT GHOST RECON AS WE KNEW IT or as we WANTED IT !!!! START A POLL and you'd FIND 90% + AGREE the GAME PLAY HAS SUFFERED THE KILLER INSTINCT HAS GONE / NO FEAR OF DEATH / RUN RUN RUN... COD & MOH BUY BUY BUY ... welcome CS3 !! it's FLAWED ... IT NEEDS ADRESSING FAST [JUNE/JULY] best regards.. Edited May 13, 2006 by viiiper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheldon_AS Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 You are right, we didnt get the game we wanted. It has issues with playability, funcionality, all of that has been gone over a thousand times. Ive said from my first post after playing, this is the game I WANT to love. It has to be fixed, but there is too much right with it to drop out and quit. I only play Ghost Recon, I have BF2 & COD2 which I dont play. I'm not a Quake, Doom or Halo player. Simply because they dont give me the same style of play as [GR]. I'm so tired of hearing the Boycott, Recall, shoot the wife & drown the kids talk. That type of message has no consructive purpose other than to help someone get something off of their chest. If you need that, go seek professional help. We as the GR community need to be critical to let GRIN know what we dont like, weve done that, some people have gone overboard with it however. Having them already release a patch to address some things shows me they care. Lets all let GRIN do their job, without flaming. Constructive criticism works best. Regards Sheldon/AlphaSquad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 What your forgetting ROCOAFZ is that GRIN KNEW THE PROBLEMS GR1 HAD and were developing with HINSIGHT !!! SO WE EXPECTED IT NOT TO HAVE THE GR1 ISSUES from the start !!!! Note in my list og GR1 problems Grin avoided that GR1 had. They actually did avoid the GR1 problems. Now with that being said a new engine introduces new problems which are being worked on.. They did also do beta testing with a few clans to try to get it stable as possible before release, but remember they are on a schedule. UBI set the date and we were demanding. The june patch i bet will have the fixes for the demo issues + issues beta testers had with a few for new arrise problems and some additional things that aren't fixes. I bet the next patch (not the june)after that we will expect to see any new issues that arrive patched and final resolution to some of the released issues They also released an intermediate patch early. That shows a difference from GR1 as they didn't release patches until expansions with GR1 (released patch at same time as the expansion with patch) On a good note with the patch releases, it makes us go outside for the summer and with it all patched by winter we will be having a blast indoors when it's cold. I like this post a lot, its got a lot of truth in it, also a good understanding of actuall reality. The Team are determined to correct issues in this game, and to improve what is already a decent game. GP Colin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Posted May 13, 2006 Share Posted May 13, 2006 What I BASACLY would have wanted in a new Ghost Recon, is Ghost Recon whit a new graphic engine, first person weapon view and even further expanded realism. I'm think that's pretty much what I got I got first person weapon view, a new engine and expanded realism. The setting is far more urban than GR1, but I can live with that. Once the MP side of things is fixed up, and mod tools are available this game will be even better. Hmm no it doenst feel or look like Ghost Recon, it has that console feeling over it. As for the "expanded realism", I only have to say three things.. no injury effect (no gimp or worser aim), no "oneshot, one kill" (you can take three hits! even one in the face whit out dying) and no blood at all (only a little splash when a bullet hit a body). Have you played GRAW on the 360 and PC? I have. PC's version of GRAW and the word "console" do not belong in the same sentence. What makes it feel like you're on a console? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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