Third Person Mod

[Beers]

Go here for a tutorial on the bundle reader:

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee/forums?a=tpc...9344#6981089344

*If you dont want to unbundle the whole data folder you can unbundle the specific .xml and put it into the local\english folder (but you have to treat it like the data folder). For the camera_settings.xml it would be local\english\settings\ for the directory...

(for more help on the local folder see the last page)

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/2.../6981089344/p/6

**LOCATION = with the bundlereader open the quick.bundle and go to settings... extract the camera_settings.xml

Edited July 7, 2006 by Beers

[n_e_w_d_u_d_e]

if you have any problem figuring it out outcast just let us know. I knew absolutly nothing about modding and had to figure it all out and it took me time, so if your new to this i know were your coming from. Whats so awesom with computer games vs console games is all the tweaking you can do. I hava the demo right now(being buying full game tormorrow prob) and thats what i started with. SO if you have the full game and you dont want to get in there and muk it up yet, work with the demo. OH and to let you know if you do manage to do this all it takes a little longer for the game to load after this, so dont worry about your game loading time being a little longer, nothings wrong with you game.

Now about the 3rd person. You guys are getting so close, i can tast it. I like that view so much i play in it alot. Now concerning not being able to zoom in with the 3rd person, if we could get it to go to a 1st person zoom that would be perfect. And i think being able to switch to 1st person for the cinamatics would be a good way around it. Im getting good at learning this game finally. Ive started to play the demo on hard and am enjoying it. Learning how to take full use of my crosscom, tactical map, and giving order as well as planning best routes to go.

Come on guys, YOU CAN DO IT. YOU CAN MOD.

Edited July 7, 2006 by n_e_w_d_u_d_e

[Commander Outcast]

Go here for a tutorial on the bundle reader:

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee/forums?a=tpc...9344#6981089344

*If you dont want to unbundle the whole data folder you can unbundle the specific .xml and put it into the local\english folder (but you have to treat it like the data folder). For the camera_settings.xml it would be local\english\settings\ for the directory...

(for more help on the local folder see the last page)

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/2.../6981089344/p/6

**LOCATION = with the bundlereader open the quick.bundle and go to settings... extract the camera_settings.xml

odd...when i try to d/l it firefox keeps crashing.

[Vth_F_Smith]

odd...when i try to d/l it firefox keeps crashing.

When you try to download what? Edited July 7, 2006 by Vth_F_Smith

[Beers]

http://nemon.myby.co.uk/BundleReader.exe

that crashes you?

Edited July 7, 2006 by Beers

[Commander Outcast]

well....it did yesterday.

[Beers]

As long as you were able to dl it. We are happy to have helped you start modding

Edited July 7, 2006 by Beers

[Commander Outcast]

uhhh.....yeah.It dled but dont work.

"the application fail to initialize properly (0xc0000135)."

thats wat it said.

[n_e_w_d_u_d_e]

if you cant get it ot download, go here:

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/2...13/m/6981089344

not sure if you know about it already. This is were i began in the modding info.

[Beers]

you have net frame works 2.0 right?

tutorial:

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee/forums?a=tpc...9344#6981089344

Edited July 8, 2006 by Beers

[n_e_w_d_u_d_e]

you have net frame works 2.0 right?

tutorial:

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee/forums?a=tpc...9344#6981089344

Well guys, i bought the full version of the game yesterday. I just need to wait for it to come in the mail now. It should get here by end of next week. I hope is all going well with the modding. Has anyone made any more improvements in the 3rd person mod?

[Roy_E_Brisby]

I've hit a pretty significant wall unfortunately, so far only the "person" cam has done anything of significance in game.

There's a catch22 of sorts going on as well, if you set the local_offset, it's what's breaking the camera while running + doing all sorts of other actions, but it does get you a nice, stable behind the back view.

But if you set it via "distance", it doesn't track sideways movement very well. However running + doing various other animations are perfectly alined with the camera.

I've figured out a few other controls, but they don't really help us in getting a good 3rd person camera.

Ironically, most of the problems with the 3rd person camera can be solved via that 1st to 3rd person toggle button. If you have problems with one camera you can just toggle it back to first person + resume playing.

Currently I have a pretty good Resident Evil 4 like camera going (over the right shoulder slightly) - the camera has to be pretty close to Mitchell to offset some of the other camera problems. Leaning is working. But still there are problems :

1. No crosshair while zoomed - this one definately needs a lot of work. Something is causing the crosshair to fade out while zoomed in - this is perhaps the most significant problem I have now since it affects gameplay pretty significantly.

2. Going prone causes the camera to freak out (this is largely due to the local_offset, possible fixes may include a compromise between local_offset + distance).

I've uninstalled + reinstalled the game, and managed to play through so far 60% of level 1 in 3rd person mode (albeit with no zoom). It's definately a unique experience to say the least to play this way.

Also I've started really appreciate the model work GRIN did on Mitchell + the others in a 3rd person view (it's very solid, and they animate very well).

Ideally what I'd like to do for this is somehow add some animations to Mitchell (head idle animation, lowering of weapon so he doesn't walk around so "stiff" all the time) - just to make it a bit more natural looking a-la the xbox360 version.

From what I can tell the lowering of the gun animation is already in the game (it's what happens when you try to peek around the corner but don't leave enough room for Mitchell to extend his rifle around the corner). and some of the other stuff might be idle animations that Kirkand + others go through while idle.

There's still a *lot* of work to be done though. But it's actually looking fairly promising.

I'll try + post some progress later (pics, maybe a vid).

[Roy_E_Brisby]

Found another bug

The MP5 is unusable right now in 3rd person. We definately have to go through + hand tune a *lot* of cameras one by one after figuring out which is which. Assuming this is even the way we should go right now.

Here's a sample :

GRAW 1.20 - original screenshot is 1920x1200 (1.6 aspect ratio in game) scaled down to 1024x640 (hence the super clear AA look)

http://img280.imageshack.us/img280/9858/screenshot31qf.jpg

[Beers]

You know im going to say now... YOU GOT THE HEAD BACK (woohoo! gj! Roy_E_Brisby, Nemon, VTH_F_Smith!)... Also that RE4 camera is amazing

Edited July 8, 2006 by Beers

[Roy_E_Brisby]

I had to do it the ugly way though, with no access to a decompiler or the actual .dsf file I had to comb through the dxe file the hard way to find out how to do it

[Vth_F_Smith]

Nice camera angle!

Edited July 8, 2006 by Vth_F_Smith

[Commander Outcast]

nice, crosshair looks kinda small though.

wait, i just had a though(omg!). How do they have the 3rd person view of mitchall in the editor?Or is that just like a spawned mitchall?

Edited July 8, 2006 by Commander Outcast

[n_e_w_d_u_d_e]

hey roy, can you give us the settings you did for the current 3rd person view you are working with, the one thats giving you the resident evil look which im guessing is the picture with the head on it, or which ever you feel is the better.Would be cool if you could put it in a download form so we can just download it and then copy it to our xml files. I liked the simple one to, the body leaving the screen when you run, is no prob for me. But your right about being able to togle from 3rd person to 1st person to solve the prob. ANyway, if you wouldnt mind putting the settings on here so we can give it a try. Now, how did you add a head to him without the decompiler??? I would love to put a head on mitchell. Roy your doing a excelent job man, and everyone who is working on this. Keep it up man. thanks man.

Edited July 8, 2006 by n_e_w_d_u_d_e

[Waika]

WoWoW, Amazing Mod! Exciting progress! I really hope you guys stick with it and take this to the point where you actually release something.

I've only skimmed over the various issues you're experiencing, but one thing I've learned in modding is that there are often hard code limits to what you can do, and thinking outside the limitations you're experiencing to get your desired result is often necessary.

For example, and I don't know if this is actually the case but I'm really just making an illustration: perhaps the 3rd person cam just can't be stable, practical or aesthetically acceptable in some circumstances and in those instances the perspective can zoom back to the first person perspective or there may be some clever way to make the model disappear smoothly all together.

A corollary example: perhaps some game features just can't work in a stable, practical or aesthetically functional manner with the 3rd person cam active -- that doesn't have to be a bad thing as long as there can be a transition where things work in the default manner.

A tidy culling of features, functions that make your mod function in a clean and aesthetically consistent and functional manner -- may be more practical then getting everything working in some ideal form or replica of console camera design perhaps even offering something better...

Would for example a Ghost Recon 2 OTS style cam be more easily achievable? Best of wishes, and thanks for posting all your cool progress and technical info!

[n_e_w_d_u_d_e]

WoWoW, Amazing Mod! Exciting progress! I really hope you guys stick with it and take this to the point where you actually release something.

I've only skimmed over the various issues you're experiencing, but one thing I've learned in modding is that there are often hard code limits to what you can do, and thinking outside the limitations you're experiencing to get your desired result is often necessary.

For example, and I don't know if this is actually the case but I'm really just making an illustration: perhaps the 3rd person cam just can't be stable, practical or aesthetically acceptable in some circumstances and in those instances the perspective can zoom back to the first person perspective or there may be some clever way to make the model disappear smoothly all together.

A corollary example: perhaps some game features just can't work in a stable, practical or aesthetically functional manner with the 3rd person cam active -- that doesn't have to be a bad thing as long as there can be a transition where things work in the default manner.

A tidy culling of features, functions that make your mod function in a clean and aesthetically consistent and functional manner -- may be more practical then getting everything working in some ideal form or replica of console camera design perhaps even offering something better...

Would for example a Ghost Recon 2 OTS style cam be more easily achievable? Best of wishes, and thanks for posting all your cool progress and technical info!

I would just like to see a 3rd person view with all guns. If we can accomplish that then thats enough for me with the current mod settings.

[ruggbutt]

This is going to be abused in m/p. You can see around corners in third person, where you can't in first person. The mod is cool, but I'm just sayin.............

[Vth_F_Smith]

This is going to be abused in m/p. You can see around corners in third person, where you can't in first person. The mod is cool, but I'm just sayin.............

Keep in mind: It won't work if the client or the server is using a different (non-modded) file. Both of them have to use the same file or the mod won't work at all. So it's highly unlikely that someone might be able to abuse it! Edited July 9, 2006 by Vth_F_Smith

[Waika]

This is going to be abused in m/p. You can see around corners in third person, where you can't in first person. The mod is cool, but I'm just sayin.............

Sorry but that's just ridiculous; virtually every console Clancy game plays in third person, and if it was "abused" to any extent few would be playing any of them, buying subsequent releases, or so excited about each new game... More importantly third person perspective is considered essential in virtually every 2D projected ST ground combat simulator for a slew of reasons...

Suggesting you can't see around corners in first person is also incorrect as you can lean -- further the lean animation and camera are not 100% WYSIWYG as far as what all players see relative to multiple positions at opposite sides of particular a corner...

As Vth_F_Smith says if this is a server side mod everyone will have the same perspective and any degree of improved peripheral vision or extent that you're able to peek around a corner will be equal to all players. While perhaps not absolutely equal to all persons at all positions relative to a particular corner it's not not the case with leaning in GRAW either.

Generally speaking a third person perspective can offer a substantial improvement in the realism of game-play and the realism of the tactics people play with... The 'First Person Perspective' we have in FPS games is not really first person, it's technically Pseudo FPP or more correctly 'Second Person Perspective' as those are not your hands on the screen...

A 'Second Person Perspective' even with leaning is flawed in terms of absolute scale realism in may regards in addition to not being a real 'First Person Perspective' and the unrealistic issues if forces on game-play not the least of which include: you can't really tell in if your torso is under real cover from fire, you can't realistically tell if you're reasonably concealed, your peripheral vision is unrealistically narrowed by about 80%, and you can not check your peripheral area without shifting your point of aim...

These and many other reasons are why tactical simulators like VBS1, and games like Armed Assault (which also offers leaning) offer a third person perspective... Realistic peripheral vision and situational awarness with regard to your cover, concealment, the relative positions of and cover fire your squad mates can offer, the fire lines of an enemy position can be more realistically ascertained, and manuver tactics can be more realistically executed with on FOV limited flat display devides via a 'Third Person Perspective'.

Edited July 9, 2006 by Waika

[n_e_w_d_u_d_e]

no cheating for me!!

Edited July 10, 2006 by n_e_w_d_u_d_e

[n_e_w_d_u_d_e]

This is going to be abused in m/p. You can see around corners in third person, where you can't in first person. The mod is cool, but I'm just sayin.............

Sorry but that's just ridiculous; virtually every console Clancy game plays in third person, and if it was "abused" to any extent few would be playing any of them, buying subsequent releases, or so excited about each new game... More importantly third person perspective is considered essential in virtually every 2D projected ST ground combat simulator for a slew of reasons...

Suggesting you can't see around corners in first person is also incorrect as you can lean -- further the lean animation and camera are not 100% WYSIWYG as far as what all players see relative to multiple positions at opposite sides of particular a corner...

As Vth_F_Smith says if this is a server side mod everyone will have the same perspective and any degree of improved peripheral vision or extent that you're able to peek around a corner will be equal to all players. While perhaps not absolutely equal to all persons at all positions relative to a particular corner it's not not the case with leaning in GRAW either.

I like seeing my character. i think both views look great i just enjoy the game when i have a character to look at. I want to see his reactions to me moving him around. Im all for it and hope we can get this to a very acceptable playable mod. Im excited about it, and since my game will in the mail next week, i cant wait to play the full game and team up online with peeps.

Generally speaking a third person perspective can offer a substantial improvement in the realism of game-play and the realism of the tactics people play with... The 'First Person Perspective' we have in FPS games is not really first person, it's technically Pseudo FPP or more correctly 'Second Person Perspective' as those are not your hands on the screen...

A 'Second Person Perspective' even with leaning is flawed in terms of absolute scale realism in may regards in addition to not being a real 'First Person Perspective' and the unrealistic issues if forces on game-play not the least of which include: you can't really tell in if your torso is under real cover from fire, you can't realistically tell if you're reasonably concealed, your peripheral vision is unrealistically narrowed by about 80%, and you can not check your peripheral area without shifting your point of aim...

These and many other reasons are why tactical simulators like VBS1, and games like Armed Assault (which also offers leaning) offer a third person perspective... Realistic peripheral vision and situational awarness with regard to your cover, concealment, the relative positions of and cover fire your squad mates can offer, the fire lines of an enemy position can be more realistically ascertained, and manuver tactics can be more realistically executed with on FOV limited flat display devides via a 'Third Person Perspective'.

Yeah their might be some people that use it for cheating purpose , but for one i will not be one of them. Im used to playing in 3rd person view in games. This has been the first real tactial shooter that i have played and enjjoyed. This is mostly due to the fact that it has the coop option. For instance i rented Over the HEdge the video game. NOw im 28 years old and i imagine about now your saying "WHAT!!! over the hedge. Well its 2 player and me and my brother love playing 2 player games were you can beat the game in a coop mode. Im also not big into really violent games. this game is about as violent as i get, but the this game istn a game that trying to sell it self by being a violent based game. Well with that being said, i could love to be able to play this game in a desent 3rd person view. But shoot, 3rd or no 3rd this is a awesome game. Ive never been able to understand why people woould want to cheat anyway. Well , i would say anyway that this is one of the great mods for this game. Hopefully ill be able to find some people for some online coop. Some good players that wont run ahead and get shoot, that wont just go and take everybody out because he already knows the level inside out. Im really lookingn forward to this game, and looking forward even more to this mod so keep it up guys.