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Taking a Hit - Lack of Immediate & Noticable Effect/Punishment


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Sure one bullet one kill could be quite good if shoot from a close distance. I mean, the kevlar should be able to stop some bullets from a far distance, right?

Kevlar may stop a bullet from going through someone, but I'm guessing they will be acutely aware of the contact, to the point where nobody's going to be able to pivot and bring their weapon up to bear immediately after taking a hit. As it stands, that's almost exactly how things often play out now. Kevlar or not, when someone shoots a burst into your back and you can turn around and shoot them back . . . meh.

At range, if you take a non-lethal shot, you shouldn't be able to return fire immediately after; however, you can duck behind cover, recover, etc. At close range, the suggestions in this post mean you'd be a sitting duck to be finished off . . . which makes perfect sense, to me. Having these head-to-head, "who can get more bullets into the other guy first" confrontations just doesn't cut it, for me.

Ok, so GRIN should keep the current 'effect' when taking shoots from a far distance but add more punishment when taking shoots from a closer distance? That's what I would like anyway :grin3:

No, I'm not making any kind of specific prescription, but I don't think range should factor into it that much, at all, to be honest. You get hit by a bullet, you jerk. A lot. Regardless of how far it came from. Regardless of whether you're scoped or not. GR1's damage model was pretty unforgiving, and while I'm all for GRAW being different, I just think that a single bullet, no matter the range or the caliber, should matter. It should matter to the point that if you get hit by one, you're not going to be able to return fire right away, and yes, it's very likely the beginning of the end for you. The fact that you can take as much punishment as you can is pretty generous; I think being concerned that you can't properly defend yourself immediately after a bullet hits you (and you still survive it) is somewhat ludricrous.

Edited by DisgruntledArchitect
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DisgruntledArchitect, you know when you put it that way. it changes my mind. Hey, your were more co-vert than your oponant, that is your prize for seeing him first. Your not ment to be able to defend your self from a bullet fire. Your defence is not being seen or team mates covering your 6.

If your seen in real life its over...So I guess i'm for it now =) haha, see what comes out of mature debating =) rather then flaming.

Edited by XenoSoft
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No, I'm not making any kind of specific prescription, but I don't think range should factor into it that much, at all, to be honest. You get hit by a bullet, you jerk. A lot. Regardless of how far it came from. Regardless of whether you're scoped or not. GR1's damage model was pretty unforgiving, and while I'm all for GRAW being different, I just think that a single bullet, no matter the range or the caliber, should matter. It should matter to the point that if you get hit by one, you're not going to be able to return fire right away, and yes, it's very likely the beginning of the end for you. The fact that you can take as much punishment as you can is pretty generous; I think being concerned that you can't properly defend yourself immediately after a bullet hits you (and you still survive it) is somewhat ludricrous.

As long as you don't die by a single bullet (except for an HS) then I'm pleased. Punishment is good, like you said, but as long as you don't die right away then the feature is good enough for me :grin1:

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First of all I only play CO-OP...

Why can't the Ghost player have the same animations when hit as the other NPCs (Ghosts and tangos)? This coupled with FAR LESS hits required to be killed would cause people to be more careful about being shot. Please allow the weight of our kits to actually have an affect on movement speed and have a stamina system that actually does something, especially after being "hit".

If what I'm asking for is considered too difficult for casual players to handle in game, then at least make this some sort optional difficulty level setting.

silent_op

Edited by silent_op
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Why can't the Ghost player have the same animations when hit as the other NPCs (Ghosts and tangos)? This coupled with FAR LESS hits required to be killed would cause people to be more careful about being shot.

Yes, IMO this would be very nice. But i think it is ok that you can survive 2-4 hits, WHEN you fall when hit (or the same way the AI does .. i dont remeber if they fall every time).

You will survive a firefight when you are behind cover or if you are working with your team, but you'll be dead when you run towards the enemy in full auto mode ... And i think that will make the online gameplay much better!

If what I'm asking for is considered too difficult for casual players to handle in game, then at least make this some sort optional difficulty level setting.

Yeah, IF it is possible to add this as a new difficulty level (easy - normal - hard -- realistic) and as a server option, it wouldnt hurt anyone who dont like a more realistic gameplay, cause they can play the game on easy/normal/hard (just as now) or on servers without 'relistic mode' turned on! :thumbsup:

Or is this technically impossible to do? (i dont know anything about progamming)

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GRIN, you could make an 'arcade' mode and a 'realistic' mode for this feature, then everyone whould be happy :grin2:

:thumbsup: nice idea!

It would be very cool if GRAW would offer the 'normal' and a 'realistic' mode! (for SP and MP)!!

I agree with that, Realistic removing any triangles and incorporating the clear hud would be great especially if you could set this server side.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi

I would be really pleased if one of you Grin_Members could answer this question:

Do you plan (or consider) to add anything more than we have now? Any of the suggestions in this thread? (there are some really good ideas IMO)?

Or wont you go any further than you did with patch 1.16 concerning this topic?

sorry for bringing up this thread again but for me this is the main thing i would like to see changed in GRAW.

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This short clip recorded yesterday durin Domination play shows why i dont like current damage system.

Completely off-topic, but what was the language? Heard a sentence or two in there and don't immediately recognize it. Thanks...

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I made a quick recording of me shooting and being shot at by someone else:

sound sample

To make sure you hear what I hear: When he walks towards me and I shoot him, the impact sound on him gets gradually louder until he dies. When he shoots me later, there are some audible "thwack" sounds, along with groaning only heard by the player. Note that there are changes here not in the currently released patch.

Please take a look and then tell me what exactly it is you feel is lacking. I'd like to hear all your opinions on this, but please be specific and stay on topic.

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I made a quick recording of me shooting and being shot at by someone else:

sound sample

To make sure you hear what I hear: When he walks towards me and I shoot him, the impact sound on him gets gradually louder until he dies. When he shoots me later, there are some audible "thwack" sounds, along with groaning only heard by the player. Note that there are changes here not in the currently released patch.

Please take a look and then tell me what exactly it is you feel is lacking. I'd like to hear all your opinions on this, but please be specific and stay on topic.

It looks good, but i would like to watch u trying to shoot the other guy back.

I wanna see if u can do that or u cant aim when u are being shot.

If u have any punishment for being hit, both when u are being shot and after it if u manage to escape wounded.

Sorry if its not clear enough or u were only asking about the sounds.

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I made a quick recording of me shooting and being shot at by someone else:

sound sample

To make sure you hear what I hear: When he walks towards me and I shoot him, the impact sound on him gets gradually louder until he dies. When he shoots me later, there are some audible "thwack" sounds, along with groaning only heard by the player. Note that there are changes here not in the currently released patch.

Please take a look and then tell me what exactly it is you feel is lacking. I'd like to hear all your opinions on this, but please be specific and stay on topic.

I can think of 2 things that would be nice.

1) Your vision gets really shaken up for a split second, along with your entire HUD (similar to Doom 3). It sucks that while your unloading a clip into a sniper he can turn around just fine and put 1 bullet in you and get the kill.

2) Depending on where you get hit there are side effects (arms your accuracy is worse, legs your speed decreases, chest you can't run but can walk fine, and if your lucky enough to survive a head shot then a nice little haze over your view.

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I think it's ok but it would be nice to have a few variations of the "thwack" sound (in [GR] you usually hear it once, max twice so it was very effective but in graw you could hear a few times before dying)

what kind of variation? a more metallic one and a more liquid one ..that's my best explanation sry

the new color fx is ok too without those fuzzy lines (I know you can't turn into red because of the teen rating so we will think about that :grin1: )

keep up the good work :thumbsup:

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I made a quick recording of me shooting and being shot at by someone else:

sound sample

To make sure you hear what I hear: When he walks towards me and I shoot him, the impact sound on him gets gradually louder until he dies. When he shoots me later, there are some audible "thwack" sounds, along with groaning only heard by the player. Note that there are changes here not in the currently released patch.

Please take a look and then tell me what exactly it is you feel is lacking. I'd like to hear all your opinions on this, but please be specific and stay on topic.

I can think of 2 things that would be nice.

1) Your vision gets really shaken up for a split second, along with your entire HUD (similar to Doom 3). It sucks that while your unloading a clip into a sniper he can turn around just fine and put 1 bullet in you and get the kill.

2) Depending on where you get hit there are side effects (arms your accuracy is worse, legs your speed decreases, chest you can't run but can walk fine, and if your lucky enough to survive a head shot then a nice little haze over your view.

It sounds good but unfortunately GRIN said that they are not going to implement any of this ideas. they say that it is to much work on animations to implement wound effects . This is total BS in my opinion :blink: but hey psssst ( i didnt say that :whistle: )

PS. The game is dying in my opinion. I hope that next 2 patches will heal it but i doubt it

:(

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I don't get hit that often.... :rofl: , but when I started online gaming I noticed sometimes it is hard to tell when you are hit...... and it is easy to die. The reticule sound when you're shot at might become louder, and being hit should definately be more noticable. it would be nice to notice the difference between hits in body armour (just thrown back and not hurt too bad) and hits that cut flesh (groin, blood and a limp maybe)

It would really be nice to see your team cover for you and one mate running towards you to see how bad it is....

I would also like to be able to see what other ghosts are looking at in the intro movies (you can look around, but give your team a whink before they get out of the helo/personell carrier, not that I am gay though)

It would really be big fun if a feature like teamspeak could be integrated in future games, make the mouth of the person move a bit and hear him speak thrugh teamspeak, realistic to the bone.

I tried teamspeak first this weekend, I hope no-one heard me eating peanuts...... :P

What are the best headphone-mic combi's for this (I bought a simple one to try out first, but noticed that a fixed mic would be better than the one dangling on the headphone cord which I have now)

I realise this post is a mess but hey I am happy and hope to become even more happy with this game! :g_withgrin:

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I think it's ok but it would be nice to have a few variations of the "thwack" sound (in [GR] you usually hear it once, max twice so it was very effective but in graw you could hear a few times before dying)

what kind of variation? a more metallic one and a more liquid one ..that's my best explanation sry

the new color fx is ok too without those fuzzy lines (I know you can't turn into red because of the teen rating so we will think about that :grin1: )

keep up the good work :thumbsup:

There are a couple of different ones, depending on the material you hit. I think it's something like flesh, padding and head, which gives the impression of "wet" sounds when hitting flesh or even more so with head, or more thud-like when hitting the padding.

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There are a couple of different ones, depending on the material you hit. I think it's something like flesh, padding and head, which gives the impression of "wet" sounds when hitting flesh or even more so with head, or more thud-like when hitting the padding.

ops sry it was hard to hear in the video... if those features are already there I'm 100% satisfied :)

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The "thud" sounds really nice now!

But if i interpreted the video clip correctly there wont be any other (IMO gameplay improving) effect/punishment?

.. its your game :(

The clip was intended to show you how I experience impacts on my computer, with the current features, not to showcase how the future will be. I want your feedback, not just telling you "this is what you get". :) "We want limping" is a good piece of feedback.

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The "thud" sounds really nice now!

But if i interpreted the video clip correctly there wont be any other (IMO gameplay improving) effect/punishment?

.. its your game :(

The clip was intended to show you how I experience impacts on my computer, with the current features, not to showcase how the future will be. I want your feedback, not just telling you "this is what you get". :) "We want limping" is a good piece of feedback.

Well I will sum up my wishes for the near future then

- Not only sound but off aim (a bit, not too much, makse more fun since you can shoot back if not hurt too bad so the old wild west show of two people shooting eachother is still possible, this is much fun!)

- Limp

- More realistic body damage when the world around you collapses (I ran through falling debri with no trouble, there were concrete blocks 1x1 meter falling on my head......)

For the future

- the teamspeak thing I stated earlier, this would really make online gaming explode and leave all other games behind..... (make it possible to discuss tactics while in the helo/apc before jumping out, then the intro movies aren't a bother anymore online coop!)

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On the Sound FX:

The effects are OK, but they need to be alot more violent. Not shure how to put it. They should be suden, quicker, louder.. Much more uncomfortable. On my computer, even with volume at max, they still seem muted and muffled. A sense of distress in the grunts would be good too.

On Wound Effects:

Aim needs to be thrown off, ALOT. You really need to discourage the old west "two people shooting each other" (Sorry Forrester). You need to encourage landing the FIRST shot, and getting the drop on your oppenent. The punishment for being shot should be severe and dibilitating.

Limping... If limping causes conflicting animations with the slide/dive animations, then by alol means cut the Slide/Dive along with run, while wounded. I have absollutely no problems with not being able to slide home while shot in the gut. Truth be told, the slide/dive features are gimicks (admittedly fun/usefull gimicks). Wound effects are gameplay. Go with gameplay everytime.

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On the Sound FX:

The effects are OK, but they need to be alot more violent. Not shure how to put it. They should be suden, quicker, louder.. Much more uncomfortable. On my computer, even with volume at max, they still seem muted and muffled. A sense of distress in the grunts would be good too.

On Wound Effects:

Aim needs to be thrown off, ALOT. You really need to discourage the old west "two people shooting each other" (Sorry Forrester). You need to encourage landing the FIRST shot, and getting the drop on your oppenent. The punishment for being shot should be severe and dibilitating.

Limping... If limping causes conflicting animations with the slide/dive animations, then by alol means cut the Slide/Dive along with run, while wounded. I have absollutely no problems with not being able to slide home while shot in the gut. Truth be told, the slide/dive features are gimicks (admittedly fun/usefull gimicks). Wound effects are gameplay. Go with gameplay everytime.

I understand..... Well I think it matters where youre hit,and with what caliber/distance.....

If you are shot wuith a light round at long range you should be able to return fire, even though your aim should be slightly off (at the moment youre hit) It is no fun that you can''t return fire for about 5 secs after being hit though realistic maybe, it takes fun out of online gaming. That's what this whole thing is about I think.

In my opinion the hits aren't noticable enough, and I dont want to hear that I'm hirt only, I want to see it too. This thread is mostly about sound, the sound sometimes is great, but the eye want's something too, and I understand the discussion between gameplay and realistic stuff. (the "whoof" of the incoming sniper round from far away is awesome.... ).

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The "thud" sounds really nice now!

But if i interpreted the video clip correctly there wont be any other (IMO gameplay improving) effect/punishment?

.. its your game :(

The clip was intended to show you how I experience impacts on my computer, with the current features, not to showcase how the future will be. I want your feedback, not just telling you "this is what you get". :) "We want limping" is a good piece of feedback.

thats nice, thanks for your reply! :thumbsup:

Ok this is my feedback / wishlist for santa ... ahh Grin: ;)

I think its not necessary to imlement limping, or to many long lasting effects.

But as statet many times, the problem with the online gameplay is that you dont have to fear being shot at. You get hit 2 times and you return full auto fire while you get hit another 2 times. But because you moved and fired full auto you hit your enemy 5-6 times ...

So my suggestion is: a hit should make you fall!

If you get hit and fall when you are in open space and your team doesnt cover you, youre dead! Cause the enemy can easily fire some more rounds.

If you are behind cover, you would fall but the enemy cant put another round into you. So you have a much better chance to survive it. That would also make the firefights more challenging and longer lasting!

This would give those an advantage who use cover, tactics, work with theyre team,

AND to those who place the first aimed shot!

And if you could make this as a new difficulty mode ("realistic") and server option, everyone would be happy! :thumbsup:

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