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http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5...&q=loose+change

Forum mods, I know this is very political.... please let it stay thoe.

Members who watch it please, keep personal political comments out of this thread. No fighting with each other.

Truth can hurt but it is better knowing then living in bliss. Sometimes you just got to know.

I want progressive posts on what you think as the american people can do to get the full facts of 9/11 released. The supposed Video/Audio, hard physical evidence etc from 9/11/01... that is missing or has never been released to the public.

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I've seen the Loose Change documentary before.

I'd advise anyone who watches it to follow it up some googling and your own research before believing anything it suggests, as with any conspiracy type film.

As this is emotive and prozac has already tried to pre-empt a lock on this subject, please try and keep this discussion logical and not emotive or it will go down hill fast and be locked. We are too busy at the top half of the forum to baby sit this bottom half <_<

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Hahaha the infamous loose change video.

If you like this, you'll LOVE Umberto Ecco's Foucault's Pendulum.  It's a conspiracy theorist's wet dream.

Hehehe, yeah some of that stuff in the documentary is... ehem... dodgy. :D But some of their questions are very interesting. Like why did the twin towers collapse so completely, and what happened to the wings, etc, of the jet hitting Pentagon?

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theres probly a million other things that make some diffrence im sure like the insulation in most boeing aircraft lights up like phosphorus under the right conditions (jet fuel beeing one of them)

What I really care about is the supposed videos from the interstate and hotels near the pentagon.

good i.e. of a nose dive into the ground with fire... things do disapear pretty quickly.

1.jpg

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What an interesting documentary...

I think the most incredible part is the theory on the Pentagon. The rest was incredibly eerie.

Just... wow. I'm on sensory overload right now after having watched that. More later when I sort my thoughts...

I suggest people take the 1:20 to watch this film. Good food for thought.

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theres probly a million other things that make some diffrence im sure like the insulation in most boeing aircraft lights up like phosphorus under the right conditions (jet fuel beeing one of them)

Maybe.. But there's still one hole in the pentagon wall with no sign of impact from the wings and engine. And if the burning was warm enough to completely melt down pretty much the whole aircraft I find it hard to believe that it was possible to find so much DNA from the passengers. The real world isn't CSI: Vegas I mean.

The footage from all the surveillance cameras are a strange story too. Why did they even release a vid without any sign of the aircraft?

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Just in case some of your google-fu isn't up to speed.

From Wikipedia

Factual inaccuracies

The film states that New York's Empire State Building was hit by a B-52 in 1945. It was actually a B-25 Mitchell, an aircraft less than one-third the size of a B-52. The authors have since apologized and acknowledged this error.

Dylan Avery claims that the motors belonging to the plane that crashed into the Pentagon, made of steel and titanium alloys, could not have melted, because the burning temperature of kerosene in even a pure oxyen environment is below the melting point of titanium. Critics contend the melting point of titanium is irrelevant since the motors involve steel-titanium alloy rather than pure titanium, although Ti alloys melt at temperatures (1668 C)[1] significantly closer to titanium (1725 C) than to steel (1500 C).

Criticisms

Loose Change has been criticized as disinformation even by some within the 9/11 Truth Movement, which disagrees with many aspects of the official version of events on 9/11/01 [2]. A primary concern of many in the movement is the promotion by documentaries such as Loose Change and In Plane Site, that a commercial jet did not hit the Pentagon [3], [4], [5], [6].

Critics of the documentary's proposal that a cruise missile or a small aircraft may have been the cause of damage to the Pentagon, cite the nearly 100 documented accounts from witnesses on the scene[7] who reported seeing a large airliner. Some witnesses specifically noted seeing a 757, while only two witnesses, located some distance from the scene, reported seeing a small plane. Loose Change, however, implies that an equal number of witnesses reported different aircraft as reported a commercial jet, and does not mention the large body of witness reports in support of a commercial jet. Critics of the missile theory note that not a single witness at the scene has ever reported seeing a missile[8].

Many do not support the suggestion put forth by Loose Change that Flight 93 landed in Cleveland instead of crashing or being shot down in Pennsylvania, and that passengers were subsequently secretly evacuated to an empty NASA research center. Critics in the 9/11 Truth Movement note that there is virtually no evidence to support this claim and that many witnesses at the time reported seeing and hearing the plane at the crash site.[9], [10].

Wikipedia was used as a source for some information from the documentary. Critics argue that since Wikipedia can be publicly and anonymously edited, the producers of the documentary could have edited articles to suit their own purposes. None of the Wikipedia-based information has yet been verified as correct or incorrect.

Influence On Pop Culture

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Even if it was plain steel it is hard to believe that human dna are usable after such an high temperature...

The amount of witnesses saying it was an 757 pretty much destroys the Loose Change theory (and their credibility), but there are a few valid questions left.

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I thought that the hole in The Pentagon was made just by the front fuselage of the plane, not the wings? I haven't seen this video yet, I'm waiting to get some free time from coursework :wall:

The wings of the aircraft is mounted pretty much at the middle of the plane, so if they didn't hit the wall more than half of the aircraft should have been lying outside... According to Loose Change only one small piece of metal was found outside.

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the wings on impact most likely started to disintegrate and swept back since it would require less energy than cut through the rest of the building. Wings and the tail section are easily broken off on such an impact.

See here for more about the pentagon.

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread79655/pg1 Parts of the plane in the pentagon were recovered. As were parts in all the crash areas.

Flight 93 was not shot down. the crash pattern is consistent with a jet impacting the ground at roughly 500mph. things scattered a hundreds of feet away are a result of only a second or two of them moving.

Most of the conspiracy theories you can find and hear about are pure BS built on half truths or complete fallacies.

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the wings on impact most likely started to disintegrate and swept back since it would require less energy than cut through the rest of the building. Wings and the tail section are easily broken off on such an impact.

Not sure, but there isn't really much point of discussing without studying the physics. (and I might as well toss in the towel before we get to that. Can't expect a construction worker to get into that kind of stuff. ;) )

Catherder did a very good job on that article, maybe except for the conclusion. Got to agree with him that an American Airlines aircraft hit the building though. But like I've said before, some odd stuff remains. :)

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Im just glad its out in the form it is and threads like this are here.

Did anyone know Dylan Avery was 20 when he made this (the first edition)? Wrote edited and voiced over ... was a student project originaly.

Anyting stated in the film is backed up (as much as it can be) at the website:

www.loosechange911.com - oddly enough the site doesnt seem to link at the moment, or maby not so oddly :ph34r::D

Got to hand it to him he has balls and is very skilled :D

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As a shop assistant might say "If you liked that, then try this" .... :D

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6...l%2Blaw&pl=true

3 hour google stream, not all 9/11 but one part of it .. more of a broader spectrum. Take it as you find it, but it was only upped 3 days ago for free stream, costing nothing to cast an eye over. (*searches for a smiley with a big eye popping out*)

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The video is very well done. It raises several legit questions. Too bad, Micheal Moore can't reach this quality. However, there are alot of things taken out of context and when you take apart history you can place in just about any order you like to fit your bias.

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  • 2 weeks later...

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=67...ybody%27s+gotta

Another 1 hour google video 9/11 questions doc. This one is put together very well raising more relevant questions. :thumbsup:

This one covers more links in the chain prior to it and more background. I guess this is political, but, rather than post slander & flames (not that you will) on it here ... just watch and make your own mind on it realy.

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