Striker-1991 Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 I'm not into sky diving and I think the jumpmaster can give commands through cross com in future. I mainly wrote about the "shame" wording and complaining before playing the game. ← No. No Jump Commands through coms. It really isn't a subject for debate. Anyone that has done this for a day understands why it isn't done now and won't be for 50 years. If you can't accept that something for which you have been waiting may have some errors in it then the conversation is pointless. It isn't like finding out that your sports idol does crack. All I said is that I don't like complaining with only screens and videos in the hand. And I doesn't mean you in this thread and not the jump procedure. I have no problem with contructive critics but I have one with "this feature is BS I won't buy the game" or "it's a shame the developers ..." stuff. It is a game. But you are being one sided. I know, therefore I want to play it, befor I decide if anything is wrong. Speculation isn't a good way. So much has been made about the accuracy in this title - plenty of people have even decided to use the 360 as a whipping boy to demonstrate their misguided beliefs. Espousing positive ideas about realism is great but you shouldn't demonstrate reluctance the first time a counterpoint to all of that surfaces. You either want to talk about a title before release or you do not. Splitting hairs to only discuss the good is a little hypocritical. And it is a feature we have now seen. ← I mostly see the positive side in the game devs. Ok I'm biased because of developing software too and I know both sides of the story. If you create something and it is satisfying you and 90% of you customers you feel happy. If you have 3% of the customers that don't like you product making 90% of the noise complaining about decisions they don't have to make, then you feel let's say not very well. If you look at my posts I'm not the one who praises the devs in every post. I like some decisions, some not but I know there is a bigger story behind the decisions like the desintegration of cars which I don't like. So all I said is wait for the game/demo and look how it fits the expectations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aCid Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 (edited) Well, it was still impressive for those of us that do not have the real world experience... It is a shame that it turns out to be realistically incorrect however... ← This is 2013, they are the Ghosts, they have cross com, what is reality in 2013? Only speculation, only a few played the game and I hear the word "shame" very often about such little things in the game (the XM8, the Abrams, the colors, the Aloe plant physics, ... ). We should wait until we get the game or the demo before complaining about things we only know from screens or videos. ← When it comes to the game you have to take the good with the bad as regards critiques. In 8 years you are just not going to see a change in a procedure that has been in place for over 60 years. It has not changed because it works. Also there is the fact you pattern a target when you drive a chute and run either a right hand or left hand pattern. Even civilian skydivers do this. The Jumpmaster moves to the rear first of all to give his commands. You are also getting physical indicators. We have com systems but when you are jumping from a high performance aircraft you do not rely on electronic communications that are taking place inside a flying magnetic field. You give hand and arm signals. Systems fail and men's lives are at risk. The Jumpmaster is also checks the area at the edge and side of the ramps to make sure there are no safety hazards. Accidents have happened because of an issue such as this before. At 12,500 feet where there is less room to recover from a small aircraft track error than at 25,000 feet in a HAHO jump, minute calculations matter. The Release Point is calculated and the Jumpmaster actually tells the pilot where the aircraft needs to fly in order to allow men to get out upwind and on track. Otherwise you are screwed. As the aircraft flies, the safety (another HALO jumpmaster) or the Jumpmaster are checking ground reference points by looking out the door or off the side of the ramp. They are making sure the aircraft is flying on track. Blind drops have been done before and they do not work. In 1985 I did one from a Combat Talon and we came down 8 klicks off of target. We have a saying, "The World is our Drop Zone." But that is because you have to come down sooner or later, it just may not be pleasant trying to dodge power lines and hit a small street when your Release Point is improper. As I said before, you jump together and group together in the air. You wave off and pull and then get in what we call a stack. Even at very low altitudes you line up with the lowest man up front. He sets the traffic pattern. This is just one reason why everyone on the Team has to be well briefed about the target. You can't always bet who the low man will be but we usually have a couple of guys that go into their pull sequence a few hundred feet later so they can set the pattern. Then you stack up and follow those guys down as they set a box pattern that looks like a square bottom letter 'J'. ← well who cares m8 not everyone buying the game is an army airborne vet like you are, and for this little tiny not noticable mistake to 98% of the poeple who will play it, there are thousands of good things that make up for it. grin has won me over, they are my fav. dev team nice intro to the game, that ###### was niiiice Edited April 18, 2006 by aCid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 LOL ... great intro to game but was a little bit calm with when responding/talking back to crosscom while hurtling toward the ground as if he was walking along. He is a Ghost man , come on Also would you realy be able to concentrate in that cross-com or hear it that well while diving? C, it works fine in game in fact you are waiting for it. Aaah, its a game and not the main point of the whole thing, nice eye candy though. ← Colin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capteenix Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 Mybe ghost are so Professional that they jump if want..note if they have own objectives they split off. since Mexico City isn't hostile for awhile they jump like people's do! My father is extreme Parachute jumper, and when he's in the air he jsut jumps, with friend, but never seen any "wingsman" when i was many times in that plane, its beatuiful view form up yes, BUT it make me crack up! do you know how i shake when watching down? "Me not Extre-meal P-P-pparachute h-hero" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiASpook Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 http://www.break.com/index/deashootfoot.html A bit of topic, but learn to handle your firearms in GR:AW people Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capteenix Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 (edited) http://www.break.com/index/deashootfoot.html A bit of topic, but learn to handle your firearms in GR:AW people ← that was hilarious....Showing how to handle wepaons save...um i mean .....you know... Edited April 18, 2006 by capteenix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reb Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 Glock 40 - 700 dollar DEA agent's face when he shoots in his own legs while trying to explain to some people that weapons are dangerous - PRICELESS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capteenix Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 (edited) Glock 40 - 700 dollar DEA agent's face when he shoots in his own legs while trying to explain to some people that weapons are dangerous - PRICELESS! ← umm...today 18th April -im watching your words in your sig..... and bo is not here...so...something stinks Edited April 18, 2006 by capteenix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reb Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 (edited) Glock 40 - 700 dollar DEA agent's face when he shoots in his own legs while trying to explain to some people that weapons are dangerous - PRICELESS! ← umm...today 18th April -im watching your words in your sig..... ← 18 April aint over yet... Better not spoil this topic talking about this. ( http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/index.php...pic=32977&st=15 ) Edited April 18, 2006 by Reb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiASpook Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 Glock 40 - 700 dollar DEA agent's face when he shoots in his own legs while trying to explain to some people that weapons are dangerous - PRICELESS! ← umm...today 18th April -im watching your words in your sig..... ← 18 April aint over yet... Better not spoil this topic talking about this. (http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=32977&st=15' ← Not to steal your thunder, but nothing coming today (my guess)...but on Friday 21st. April (my guess )... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteKnight77 Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 well who cares m8 not everyone buying the game is an army airborne vet like you are, and for this little tiny not noticable mistake to 98% of the poeple who will play it, there are thousands of good things that make up for it. grin has won me over, they are my fav. dev team nice intro to the game, that ###### was niiiice ← That was kind of a cheap shot. One thing to remember, many here are in or were in the military. We notice things like that. Still, it is one reason why I stated gameplay decision earlier when I responded to HF. Want to learn more about HF. Ask him to recommend some books about SF that he may be in. I think you would be amazed and horrified at some of the stuff he has had to do, especially when his teammates lives are on the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl Ledanek Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 Check out this HALO Jump. This is awesome and really shows off the body awareness feature really well. ← Where's the Jumpmaster, on the wings? Tsk Tsk... ← Out of frame possibly? I guess it was one of those gameplay decisions to not have one. ← Nope. The HALO Jumpmaster gives the commands. Then when the ramp opens, he inspects it and either hinself or the Safety spots for the Release Point. He either leads the jump or stands by to push everyone and then follows. That was a low jump. Seemed like 12.5. He had to spot for ground references for the release. Otherwisw winds at altitude put you in Cancun. ← Capt Mitchell will have that and the Tequila breathe to explain too Oh yeah, kudos on the crosscome while falling down. I actually found it better that way. Something else to look or distract me from hurling inside my oxygen mask----not that I wear one when I'm playing A GAME!!!!! Some ppl just can't separate themselves from a game and a reality. Sheeeshh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capteenix Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 Check out this HALO Jump. This is awesome and really shows off the body awareness feature really well. ← Where's the Jumpmaster, on the wings? Tsk Tsk... ← Out of frame possibly? I guess it was one of those gameplay decisions to not have one. ← Nope. The HALO Jumpmaster gives the commands. Then when the ramp opens, he inspects it and either hinself or the Safety spots for the Release Point. He either leads the jump or stands by to push everyone and then follows. That was a low jump. Seemed like 12.5. He had to spot for ground references for the release. Otherwisw winds at altitude put you in Cancun. ← Capt Mitchell will have that and the Tequila breathe to explain too Oh yeah, kudos on the crosscome while falling down. I actually found it better that way. Something else to look or distract me from hurling inside my oxygen mask----not that I wear one when I'm playing A GAME!!!!! Some ppl just can't separate themselves from a game and a reality. Sheeeshh. ← thats why they end up Dea...i mean horrored Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsonedecker Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 Capt Mitchell will have that and the Tequila breathe to explain too Oh yeah, kudos on the crosscome while falling down. I actually found it better that way. Something else to look or distract me from hurling inside my oxygen mask----not that I wear one when I'm playing A GAME!!!!! Some ppl just can't separate themselves from a game and a reality. Sheeeshh. ← A game that is trying to market itself and base it's existance on being REALISTIC I might add. I think that this industry should just go ahead and copywrite the term "Hollywood Realism". Believe me, movies like Black Hawk Down, while a great flick, are not all that accurate. Read the book if you want a much truer account of events. There is a big difference between hollywood realism and real life realism and developers/consumers need to be able to differentiate between them. Don't sell one as the other. At least Ubi haas the right mindset to start promoting R6:Vegas as more Hollywood Realism than true to life. It's funny, because I bet that if the in-game SCAR was blue and had a 30" barrel more than a few people around here would make a big deal of it and it would be unacceptable to them. Some people are familiar with aspects of hte military that others are not. So, they notice those things.... in this case the completely wrong jump procedure. Conversely, there is so much childish slobbering around here lately over something that 99.9% of you have not played yet, how can you be so hypocritical to go against those that are raises legit issues in the same manner? A few movies and it's the second coming of Christ! I'm all for GRIN doing a good job and giving props if the game turns out well, but this place changes direction like the wind without even knowing what it is they are praising/arguing about. -John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EasyCo Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 Check out this HALO Jump. This is awesome and really shows off the body awareness feature really well. ← Where's the Jumpmaster, on the wings? Tsk Tsk... ← Out of frame possibly? I guess it was one of those gameplay decisions to not have one. ← Nope. The HALO Jumpmaster gives the commands. Then when the ramp opens, he inspects it and either hinself or the Safety spots for the Release Point. He either leads the jump or stands by to push everyone and then follows. That was a low jump. Seemed like 12.5. He had to spot for ground references for the release. Otherwisw winds at altitude put you in Cancun. Also you exit together and group in the air. No spread apart exit times. Landing together is more important than one guy hitting the target. I have only done this over a thousand times. But hey, help WAS offered. ← Thanks for the info HF. I always enjoy reading your posts about anything special forces related. For some weird reason a few freaked out by your statement, but I found it very insightful. I hope this doesn't discourage you from posting more info like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB Crush Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 I'm all for GRIN doing a good job and giving props if the game turns out well, but this place changes direction like the wind without even knowing what it is they are praising/arguing about. -John ← Bet it reminds you of the old RSE forums, especially in the later/Post RS days. *sniffs the air* ahhh, nostalgia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsonedecker Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 I'm all for GRIN doing a good job and giving props if the game turns out well, but this place changes direction like the wind without even knowing what it is they are praising/arguing about. -John ← Bet it reminds you of the old RSE forums, especially in the later/Post RS days. *sniffs the air* ahhh, nostalgia ← Yeah, those were the days....... I used to get in trouble for posting, but kept on doing it anyway. -John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB Crush Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 Yeah, those were the days....... I used to get in trouble for posting, but kept on doing it anyway. -John ← LOL. I thought most of you were allowed to post? Well, I'm grateful that you and the others stopped by to post, answer questions and other things, ...despite all sorts of whining, speculation, and giddiness crap you probably had to endure. So thanks to you guys too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsonedecker Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 LOL. I thought most of you were allowed to post? Well, I'm grateful that you and the others stopped by to post, answer questions and other things, ...despite all sorts of whining, speculation, and giddiness crap you probably had to endure. So thanks to you guys too ← We were in the R6/RS time, but somwhere between RS and GR1 we got the Kabosh put on us. I'm sure it was for the best though. -John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoGRIN Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 This "end of the world they do not have a jump master" is cute. The reason is as always - sometimes you just don't want to delay a game more or remove a feature (HALO drop). If you as a developer decide that every detail no matter how big or large has to be 100% realistic and apeace everyone then I'll show you a game that take 10 years to do or will never hit market at all. Would you honestly rather have us remove the jump insertion than have it without the jump master. I think 99.99% would say hell no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadow2k1 Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 one good thing i like seeing is dev people from GRIN actually getting involved in forums discussions like this and giving feedback, where they cant tell us, they at least let us know they cant tell us instead of leaving us hanging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurtz Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 Totally agree with you, Bo, perfect answer. End of story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EasyCo Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 This "end of the world they do not have a jump master" is cute. The reason is as always - sometimes you just don't want to delay a game more or remove a feature (HALO drop). If you as a developer decide that every detail no matter how big or large has to be 100% realistic and apeace everyone then I'll show you a game that take 10 years to do or will never hit market at all. Would you honestly rather have us remove the jump insertion than have it without the jump master. I think 99.99% would say hell no. ← I think members were just pointing it out and didn't mean anything by it. I doubt anyones mind was changed because there is no jumpmaster... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsonedecker Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 I think members were just pointing it out and didn't mean anything by it. I doubt anyones mind was changed because there is no jumpmaster... ← No, no one's mind was changed... as you say it was just pointed out and there is nothing wrong with that. I've been at this a long time and dealt with the realism issue my entire 10+ year career. But, sometimes it's the missing "little" things that become the most notable. -John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRiN_desmond22 Posted April 18, 2006 Share Posted April 18, 2006 It's just that the Hercules insertion was completely Grin's extra idea, and it was put in only because graphic artists and animators and all worked night shifts to get us in the position where we could only agree we had to put it in there. We fought hard to get that Hercules insertion in there - it wasn't in the original game design and in a project like GRAW you don't just "throw stuff in" - so ya'll should see it as a great bonus. I know, I know, you guys just want to shine with your military know-how. ...but if you see from our perspective, and consider how we fought to get that feature in, the pointing out of flaws in realism and "I know better than you" attitude is a punch in the face of those who worked so hard to get it in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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