GRiN_desmond22 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Well dude, lets talk about sound......lets talk about it indeed! What new techniques in sound technologies/tricks are developers using these days. What are you guys using for GRAW? In what way are you taking advantage of creative's Xfi system? I assume you are. OMG gun sounds dude!!!!! Are all sound effects in game now including gun sounds stereo as opposed to the original game's mono sounds? What were your sound sources for the game? Did you guys go out to a gun range and fired gun shots and recorded them? Tell us stuff man!! Hey, you offered!! ← It's always best to start off with sounds that are as "dry" (rid of effects) as possible. When you record music, for example, you don't have delay or reverb effects on the guitars when doing the original recording - even if you know you want delay or reverb on the song eventually - because that would mean that if you later realized you recorded it with too much delay or reverb, you can't take it away. Instead, you record evetything dry, and add effects as you see fit later on. Digital effects can help you put exactly the right effect on your sounds, and that goes for weapon sounds and explosions as well as guitars. Recording weapons is a huge undertaking - you can't do it an inddor gun range because there would be too much room reverb on the recording. Rent "SWAT" (crappy movie, I know) and watch the extra material - there they show how you're supposed to record weapon sounds. It's a very complicated procedure which is better left to those who know exactly what they're doing. Even though I know how I want the sounds to be in the game, I don't know enough about recording them for me to be a justified part of the recording work. In short, there are companies that do this sort of stuff much better than I could ever do - that lets you buy weapon sounds which you then can mix as you see fit, which is what we've done. Also, as I said, I had full access to the sounds of the 360 version. All you PC patriots can tease your 360 owning friends in knowledge of that all those sounds have been pimped for the PC version. About stereo vs mono, we let them both work together to create a thick soundscape. A 3d sound played at a certain position needs to be a mono sample. We, however, trigger corresponding echo sounds for all distinctive sounds, so that two mono sounds in the 3d environment work together to really surround you. It's like a 3d stereo sound - something I've never seen in games before. Close up to explosions, helicopters and other "big" sounds, there are also traditional stereo sounds played in 2d (with realistic rolloff) to make the sounds larger. When you fire your own gun, there is a plethora of 2d stereo sounds and 3d mono sounds that cooperate to really convey the power of your weapon. It's always a balance between making the weapon sound badazz, and making the weapon sound not-so-tiring to listen to for prolonged periods of time. If eveything sounded like a Hollywood movie (where the action goes on for one or two minutes and then pauses for 15) in a game (where the action can be non-stop for hours on end), players would turn the sound off after 30 minutes - and no sound designer wants that. Listening to footsteps is very important in MP, which, subsequently, makes it very important to make your own footsteps make less noise. Of course walking our crawling makes less noise than running, and certain materials make less noise than others. Needless to say, the stealth aspect of GRAW very much goes into the sound aspect of the game too. Right now I'm working on making the sound of a grenade that comes rolling on the ground make less noise than a grenade which is thrown. The AI is already programmed to have a harder time reacting to a rolling grenade than one that comes flying - my work on the sound aspect of it will make things work the same way even in MP! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRiN_desmond22 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 ok GRiN_desmond22 heres a couple of questions for you c 1) could you tell me a little about what lengths you've gone to to really make it sound realistic. eg. have you a mass of sampled sounds or just a few with filters & effects to make the shots sound out in the open, in allyways, tunnels, hitting stone, Glass, cars, zipping past you ears, hitting flesh, tyres wood etc.... As stated in my previous post, bullet hits as well as gunfire is a tricky thing to record. The sounds of GRAW PC is a blend of touched-up sounds form the 360 version, sounds I've recorded myself, and licensed sounds from recording studios that know this kind of stuff. I have gone great lengths to make the sounds change depending on the environment. Even the bullet hit sounds change character with distance - listeening to a distant firefight in an MP match just makes you go "I WANN BE THERE!" and start running towards it. 2) is there much music in the game? If so by which artist or did you write it yourself? Yes there is music - it's very much "The Rock" style, which I personally think fits the game very well. If it's not your cup of tea, you can turn it off or just lower the volume. I've been told the music was written by an American composer. I've done some work on the sound loops to allow the music to be more dynamic, and go up and down between different levels of intensity depending on what's happening on-screen. 3) are there things like interactive radio's etc... I know it's childish but I'd love to turn on a ingame stereo & have some inappropriate music. of course tacticaly it could be a diversion or cover other sounds There are radio sounds coming from houses in the game, although you can't go in there and change the channel. Sorry. 4) can you tell what your walking on just with your ears? Broken Glass, Grass, Stone slaps, sane etc... Oh yes, very much so. There are like 20 different surfaces to walk on, and there are unique sounds triggered depending on how you move on that surface - running, walking, sitting down and dragging one knew behind you (shuffling), crawling, crawling fast, diving from running upright, diving from running crouched, etc... the foley sound is very sophisticated. 5) Is the music in the choppers? Yeah, some real 'Nam style rock, hehe. 6) how about wildlife? While sneaking is it possible to disturb Birds? etc.. which might gove your position away? There are crickets, birds, frogs, dogs barking in the distance, you name it... 7) what speaker set up would make a big difference The sound is great in a pair of headphones, but any 5.1 or 7.1 system is always better - so that you feel the roaring BASS when you squeeze the trigger on your SAW (I just love that sound) ← Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTF-2 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 I'd just like to say how great it is to have all you GRIN guys here. Thanks. Thanks for that bit on making the sounds Desmond22. It was a great read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRiN_desmond22 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Will walls muffle or silence gunshots? or is it one of those deals where no matter where you are you can hear things from everywhere. A lot of games now you can hear everything and instantly pinpoint exactly where on the map it's coming from. I think it'd be awesome if walls actually acted like walls and dampened sound. ← EAX makes walls muffle stuff. It truly takes the realism of the audio to the next level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay316 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Speaking of environments, I really wanted to play a game that made me feel like I'm in one of those special forces operators in the mountains of afghanistan, on horseback, complete with a full beard and modded m4. I want to play a game that makes me feel like I'm in the nitty gritty real special forces world. The game graw seems to be is a futuristic army unit. Perhaps mods will be able to achieve what we're looking for. ← I think by the sounds of it what you are looking for is CENTCOM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTF-2 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 GRIN_bogvaldt: you said that you were involved with the weapons and characters yes? My main contributions to the game are (but not limited to) the 2gun.gif (first person weapons) and ph34r.gif (characters). What can you tell us about those? Any insights into the weaps or characters would be appreciated if you've got the time. Did you have the freedom to pick specific weaps for the PC version? How about style? Does each character kinda have their own style? How did you go about deciding that stuff? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost9 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 EAX makes walls muffle stuff. It truly takes the realism of the audio to the next level. ← Sounds awesome. can't wait! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRiN_desmond22 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 About sounds and ######, does the AI enemy yell commands at each other in combat and stuff like that? ← Yes the enemies shout orders to each others in Spanish - it's really immersive (oh no, it's one of those gaming buzzwords). But seriously, it really creates an atmosphere of Mexico. I remember playing Delta Force and Delta Force II back in the day (anyone else whas into that?), where you snuck into a rural village in some middle-eastern country and when the crap hit the fan and everybody started yelling in some language you didn't even recognize you went like "YES!". Someone asked if you'd be able to sneak up on enemy patrols talking to each other - that is one thing I decided to cut because I think it's a little off the target. I want the patrolling enemies to feel dangerous, on guard, ready for action - not walk around like it's any given day talking about how many cartons of milk they are to pick up after the've called it a day. The city is in a floggin' state of emergency for cryin' out loud! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 lol that's a 125% Stalker_Zero there! Beard or not, you better be better at GR:AW then at AA when you play on my team bro ROFL I just hope moddability will be at least on par with [GR]...From there we can count on many great modders out there to stretch the lifespan of GRAW to it's extreme limit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brettzies Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Is the "view counter" on this thread for real? At first I was like, wow, a lot of people are interested in this, but it jumped form 9x,000 to 10x,000 pretty quickly in one refresh. Hitting refresh, it goes up by 100 each time. I'm all for the game being popluar, but bogus stats aren't gonna help any. If it's for real then.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Striker-1991 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Just watched the HD trailer from IGN, every in game frame is wort a screen shot Ett mästerverk GRIN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Just watched the HD trailer from IGN, every in game frame is worth a screen shot Ett mästerverk GRIN ← Already under way bro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 (edited) Yes the enemies shout orders to each others in Spanish - it's really immersive (oh no, it's one of those gaming buzzwords). But seriously, it really creates an atmosphere of Mexico. I remember playing Delta Force and Delta Force II back in the day (anyone else whas into that?), where you snuck into a rural village in some middle-eastern country and when the crap hit the fan and everybody started yelling in some language you didn't even recognize you went like "YES!". ← Great, now we've got to learn Spanish... I tried both Delta Force and DFII, but I didn't know English back then so I gave up pretty fast. BHD was cool, it's just like in real life, women were tossing stones at me there too. If hes cia then hes part of the CIA paramilitary. They are recruited directly from the special forces. ← Yeah, I think they were called SOG special operations group.. Sounds like a bad clan. lol The cross-com could be on a PDA instead of wearing something looking like the Oakley MP3 sunglasses. I hope somebody makes a CIA ops mod for GRAW. Edited March 31, 2006 by Zaxis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poita Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 (edited) Grin desmond22 In OpFlash there was some good sound but it was not programmed well. You could hear running footsteps from a mile away. Also crawling throg bushes was not sounded appropriately. I asked earlier about GRAW PC if you could hear an enemy near by on his belly crawling around. Sometimes in games like GR1 or OpFlash it's a terrible shock to suddenly realise that an enemy is right near you because you just heard a reload sound, crawl or even him fireing his weapon. That would sometimes make me jump out of my skin or send tingles down my spine. In CS i always paid close attention to footsteps too. So what about bushes, i guess there are some. Most games have them either ghost shrubs that you just pass through with no visual or audio effect but in real life they make a hell of a noise when you brush against them. Can you talk about that a bit. Also, in the walk/run options is there a 'creep slowly/silently as if your life depended on it' key? Edited March 31, 2006 by Poita Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silent_op Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Bo and GRINs a like, I have a few questions for you... - The slide and dive moves, are they affected by the type of surface the Ghost is sliding/diving across? - Can the slide and dive move be modified through modding? For example, if we create an arctic map (with snow and ice), can the modder/scriptor adjust the amount of simulated friction on the map surface? This would obviously allow the Ghost to slide further. I asked Bo if the weapon selection screen will have numeric values instead of bar graphics. Bo replied that there will not be any numeric values representing the weapon stats. - Would it possible to make the graphic bars graduated (without numeric values)? The use of graduated bars would still give the player a quick visual graphic representation of the weapon stats. This would also enable the player to have a quantitative understanding of the stats. (example: An M9 has 2 tick marks (or squares) less in accuracy than an MP5) silent_op Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLCSeMPeRFi Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 (edited) Will GRIN be releasing the mod tools on launch? Edited March 31, 2006 by RLCSeMPeRFi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Is the "view counter" on this thread for real? At first I was like, wow, a lot of people are interested in this, but it jumped form 9x,000 to 10x,000 pretty quickly in one refresh. Hitting refresh, it goes up by 100 each time. I'm all for the game being popluar, but bogus stats aren't gonna help any. If it's for real then.... ← Yeh, they are for real. The forum software keeps track, it's all automatic. As you may have noticed the server is struggling to cope with the massive traffic right now and you may get a connection error occasionally, I am getting it looked into. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoGRIN Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 I wonder if you can pick up enemy weapons? ← One thing you should really avoid is picking up a weapon from someone you just sprayed with bullets or threw a nade at. The Ghosts can salvage ammo but do not pick up enemy weapons in favour of their own great kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silent_op Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 One thing you should really avoid is picking up a weapon from someone you just sprayed with bullets or threw a nade at. The Ghosts can salvage ammo but do not pick up enemy weapons in favour of their own great kit. ← I understand your point. - Is it possible for a Ghost pick up a fallen Ghost member's weapon (not just the ammo)? silent_op Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoGRIN Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Will GRIN be releasing the mod tools on launch? ← Yes. Not talking more on that right now though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Druac_Blaise Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Will GRIN be releasing the mod tools on launch? ← Yes. Not talking more on that right now though. ← !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph_Q Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Will GRIN be releasing the mod tools on launch? ← Yes. Not talking more on that right now though. ← Great News Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehgler_AS Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Will GRIN be releasing the mod tools on launch? ← Yes. Not talking more on that right now though. ← I had not been able to read this thread for about 24 hours. Now there is so much good news and information. Thanks to all the Grin folks for taking the time to help us understand what you have built. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simulacra Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 I've got a q that I haven't seen been asked yet. Will there be some sort of wierd mouse acceleration in menus, just like we see in a number of games these days, it's kinda like there's a delay beteween my hand and the pointer on the screen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalker_Zero Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 One thing you should really avoid is picking up a weapon from someone you just sprayed with bullets or threw a nade at. The Ghosts can salvage ammo but do not pick up enemy weapons in favour of their own great kit. ← I understand your point. - Is it possible for a Ghost pick up a fallen Ghost member's weapon (not just the ammo)? silent_op ← Thats an excellent question! Well, if for instance you were playing a sp game or a co-op game where the respawns were set to zero then I wouldn't see a problem being able to pick up a weapon from a fallen comrade. Unless of course the devs disagree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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