Toniezz Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 (edited) Best developers of GRAW PC, I have some questions about the citizens of Mexico city. In the storyline the US President, the Canadian Prime Minister and the Mexican President are attacked by Mexican soldiers while they are signing the document NAJSA (North American Joint Security Agreement). The Mexican President, saved by the Ghosts, gives the ghosts 'green light' to intervene and bring back Democracy by capturing Mexican military officials who went bad. I was wondering how the citizens of Mexico City look towards the presence of the Ghosts? Are they pro, against or neutral at the US and Mexican President? Is the operation taking place in a Mexico City that is suppressed by the Mexican military forces? Because I know that you can't comment on the Multi-Player part of the game (which I respect ) I have some questions about the Single Player missions: 1) Does life continue on the streets of Mexico City? In other words are there citizens going to work? Are they walkin' on the street, takin' public transport and driving their cars? 2) If so, I would guess the Ghosts are ordered to keep low casualties amongst the citizens as much as possible. How is this evaluated/judged in the game? In other words, is there a maximum kill rate amongst non-combattants before a mission is 'failed'? 3) If the 'gone wrong' Mexican military has also an amount of citizens behind them in their search for power, are there terrorists amongst the citizens? In other words, can we expect ambushes from citizan-looking 'bad-guys', car-bombs and booby traps (inside (ware)houses etc)? I would like to know because I think the citizens in [GR] gives a very good representation of a real ('city-like') battle-field. You can't just go in and shoot at everybody. I know that I, and probably a lot of others also, sometimes jumped from their chair when a refuge came running right past you or in front of you. Those moments you really see how good your reaction is on pulling the trigger or holding fire! Also the call whether or not opening fire on enemies with refugees standing near them is a nice aspect which has [GR] worked out very good! Do you empty your GL on the enemies location, give every teammember a (or more) tango's to take down, or do you do it silenced and from a safe distance with your sniper, picking them off one by one? I have looked here at GR.net and on the UBI forum if this was asked before, but haven't come up with a result. If this is already discussed and answered sorry for that! @ the Developers: Thanx for your time and good luck with the last few yards! Cheer'zz, Toniezz. Edited March 9, 2006 by Toniezz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silent_op Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 I would guess that for the most part, the Mexican citizens probably don't even know the Ghosts are there (until the fighting starts). My guess would be that most are neutral and don't really want to walk around in a storm of bullets. I hope that if there are citizens roaming around, they get the heck out of the area as soon as explosions and gun shots start going off. I hate being penalized for citizen AI that just doesn't know not to walk out into my line of fire. Instead of failing the mission, maybe civilian casualties caused by the Ghosts starts to turn the general public against them. I believe the GR:AW story line already has some foreign fighters involved in the uprising. There are Columbian FARC joining in (I'm sure I read that). That could be interesting, now it would become difficult to tell a FARC rebel from an innocent citizen. Most likely I'm sure that all of the real world complex political aspects of civilian casualties will not be in GR:AW. If it were, I would be very surprised. I would rather GRIN spend all that extra AI work on the tangos. silent_op Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFLUFAN Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 I can tell you that after playing the 360 version of the game, the residents of Mexico City have completely disappeared and there are none to be seen in what is the world's most populous metropolis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fedayn Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 we'll get some answers or this silent 'll continue until may?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toniezz Posted March 9, 2006 Author Share Posted March 9, 2006 (edited) I can tell you that after playing the 360 version of the game, the residents of Mexico City have completely disappeared and there are none to be seen in what is the world's most populous metropolis. ← That could very well be, but I know now by various posts that "the 360 and the PC have no game play simillarities". Comparing the game on these two different platforms is as comparing apples with pears . They are both fruit but are totally different in its species! Hmmm, gonna get me an apple. Oh btw, I also hope that the citizens are that smart, that they hide and find a safe refuge when the shooting starts. I think the way the citizens in Delta Force Black Hawk Down reacted was good enough. As soon as they spotted you they found some shelter. And sometimes they even started throwing stones at you. I agree with you Silent_Op that they shouldn't have a real big infuence on the gameplay, or even a mission depending on it. Just let the tango's be the judge of that . I really don't want any 'urban-sims' attitude going on there, hehe. That is absolutely not where I am aiming at. But the 'ambush aspects', I think, are something which gives an extra thrill effect to the game. Maybe in time, some info about this will come from the developers, I hope. Probably another topic to be patient about Thanx for your thoughts Ya'll! Edited March 10, 2006 by Toniezz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertranger12 Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 ok, youre all wrong... it was covered in WK's interview a while back, and we were basically told that the citizens have all left(i think they were evacuated). anyway toniezz i agree that it would be a cool aspect of the game having civilians running around, but to my knowledge there arent any... DR12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Striker-1991 Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 (edited) ok, youre all wrong... it was covered in WK's interview a while back, and we were basically told that the citizens have all left(i think they were evacuated). anyway toniezz i agree that it would be a cool aspect of the game having civilians running around, but to my knowledge there arent any... DR12 ← 8,7 million people evacuated ... but the presidents and the PM are in danger ok, thats all important people first Edited March 9, 2006 by Striker-1991 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyho Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 (edited) All evacuated, hmmm... such a huge city?¿ Could there please be some of them left in SP asif they've been hiding, afraid of other locals lootin' their property?¿ I really would 'like' to see that some of the civillians cross my line of fire just when I'm about to gently pull the trigger. So that I have to rearrange my tactics immediately. Edited March 9, 2006 by Eyho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFLUFAN Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 Actually there are about 26 million residents of Mexico City and its immediate environs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertranger12 Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 hey, i didnt make the game... i kno thats a lot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
connie lingus Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 How about a mod with the ghosts patrolling the US-Mexican border? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertranger12 Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 How about a mod with the ghosts patrolling the US-Mexican border? ← damn, thatd be great... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
babydave Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 i know we arent gonna get huge numbers of civilians anyway because of the resources needed to do it properly but it would be nice to have the odd one pop out now and again, it happened in embassy on GR1 so why not now? not a greatly important issue but it will probably detract from the setting a little Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCarr Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 How about a mod with the ghosts patrolling the US-Mexican border? ← Hellyeah!! Living in Texas, I'd play the that all day long!!! Wouldn't be to far from the truth, LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortfeaser Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 ok, youre all wrong... it was covered in WK's interview a while back, and we were basically told that the citizens have all left(i think they were evacuated). anyway toniezz i agree that it would be a cool aspect of the game having civilians running around, but to my knowledge there arent any... DR12 ← 8,7 million people evacuated ... but the presidents and the PM are in danger ok, thats all important people first ← I guess they learned from Katrina that when she stuff hits the fan you get the hell out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertranger12 Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 ok, youre all wrong... it was covered in WK's interview a while back, and we were basically told that the citizens have all left(i think they were evacuated). anyway toniezz i agree that it would be a cool aspect of the game having civilians running around, but to my knowledge there arent any... DR12 ← 8,7 million people evacuated ... but the presidents and the PM are in danger ok, thats all important people first ← I guess they learned from Katrina that when she stuff hits the fan you get the hell out? ← that could be true. i guess you can compare a hurricane to a rebellion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl Ledanek Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 ok, youre all wrong... it was covered in WK's interview a while back, and we were basically told that the citizens have all left(i think they were evacuated). anyway toniezz i agree that it would be a cool aspect of the game having civilians running around, but to my knowledge there arent any... DR12 ← 8,7 million people evacuated ... but the presidents and the PM are in danger ok, thats all important people first ← I guess they learned from Katrina that when she stuff hits the fan you get the hell out? ← that could be true. i guess you can compare a hurricane to a rebellion ← maybe they saw Born in East L.A-the movie http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/uploads/emoticons/default_shifty.gif' alt=':shifty:'> trailer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toniezz Posted March 10, 2006 Author Share Posted March 10, 2006 ok, youre all wrong... it was covered in WK's interview a while back, and we were basically told that the citizens have all left(i think they were evacuated). anyway toniezz i agree that it would be a cool aspect of the game having civilians running around, but to my knowledge there arent any... DR12 ← OK thanx desertranger! Do you know if there is any source to that information left? Is it here on the forum or was it a chat, which isn't written out. If you still could find the source that would be nice. Too bad that Mexico is evacuated. Not really realistic to me but hey, what can you do about it? Maybe the expansion packs will have some civilians on it. You never know! Lets hope so! Cheer'zz, Toniezz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Degamer Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 it was covered in WK's interview a while back, and we were basically told that the citizens have all left(i think they were evacuated). So thats why GRAW was delayed... They had to evacuate 8.7 Mil Civies! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Striker-1991 Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 Actually there are about 26 million residents of Mexico City and its immediate environs. ← yep, I was talking about Distrito Federal which is core Mexico City, the numbers varying from 8 to 11.5 million.... nobody knows really how many Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toniezz Posted March 10, 2006 Author Share Posted March 10, 2006 (edited) ok, youre all wrong... it was covered in WK's interview a while back, and we were basically told that the citizens have all left(i think they were evacuated). anyway toniezz i agree that it would be a cool aspect of the game having civilians running around, but to my knowledge there arent any... DR12 ← OK thanx desertranger! Do you know if there is any source to that information left? Is it here on the forum or was it a chat, which isn't written out. If you still could find the source that would be nice. Too bad that Mexico is evacuated. Not really realistic to me but hey, what can you do about it? Maybe the expansion packs will have some civilians on it. You never know! Lets hope so! Cheer'zz, Toniezz. ← With some diggin' with the search engine and re-reading all the posts I think I found what you are referring to, it was in the topic Questions for WhiteKnight77 on the last page (page 12), also see below. Hey WK I don´t know if this has been discused yet but are we going to see any civilians running around, tourists, women and children...I mean as big as these maps are going to be and being in a major city you would think you would see a civi every now and then running or driving to get out of the mayhem. People closeing thier doors and windows, such as in the trailer. Or maybe a stray dog or in the parks some pigeons or in the slums a chicken . Or is anything that moves an enemy target? (a civilian sinjorina being held at gun point....a sniper shot and we save the day ...or do we ... sorry daydreaming .) ← I don't recall seeing any civillians on the level I saw, but that does not mean that they aren't in the game. ← So it is not final that there are no civilians in the pc game. Maybe this is also one of the aspect they are working on at this moment! Just for fun and reflection you guys should re-read the 1 December chat with Ulf, Bo and @Ryosan. Some things they (Ulf) said that would be comming soon, like "PC specific coverage, including more screenshots, audio teasers, live in-game footage, and more", are still not here . Funny to see what you can find in the archive ! But to get back on topic, I really would like a Developers word in this topic (BoGRIN maybe ). It seems to me that hard evidence of an abandoned Mexico City is yet to be found/given. Again thanx at forehand! Later'zz, Toniezz. Edited March 10, 2006 by Toniezz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertranger12 Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 ok, youre all wrong... it was covered in WK's interview a while back, and we were basically told that the citizens have all left(i think they were evacuated). anyway toniezz i agree that it would be a cool aspect of the game having civilians running around, but to my knowledge there arent any... DR12 ← OK thanx desertranger! Do you know if there is any source to that information left? Is it here on the forum or was it a chat, which isn't written out. If you still could find the source that would be nice. Too bad that Mexico is evacuated. Not really realistic to me but hey, what can you do about it? Maybe the expansion packs will have some civilians on it. You never know! Lets hope so! Cheer'zz, Toniezz. ← With some diggin' with the search engine and re-reading all the posts I think I found what you are referring to, it was in the topic Questions for WhiteKnight77 on the last page (page 12), also see below. Hey WK I don´t know if this has been discused yet but are we going to see any civilians running around, tourists, women and children...I mean as big as these maps are going to be and being in a major city you would think you would see a civi every now and then running or driving to get out of the mayhem. People closeing thier doors and windows, such as in the trailer. Or maybe a stray dog or in the parks some pigeons or in the slums a chicken . Or is anything that moves an enemy target? (a civilian sinjorina being held at gun point....a sniper shot and we save the day ...or do we ... sorry daydreaming .) ← I don't recall seeing any civillians on the level I saw, but that does not mean that they aren't in the game. ← So it is not final that there are no civilians in the pc game. Maybe this is also one of the aspect they are working on at this moment! Just for fun and reflection you guys should re-read the 1 December chat with Ulf, Bo and @Ryosan. Some things they (Ulf) said that would be comming soon, like "PC specific coverage, including more screenshots, audio teasers, live in-game footage, and more", are still not here . Funny to see what you can find in the archive ! But to get back on topic, I really would like a Developers word in this topic (BoGRIN maybe ). It seems to me that hard evidence of an abandoned Mexico City is yet to be found/given. Again thanx at forehand! Later'zz, Toniezz. ← okay, you found questions for whiteknight, i think in his actual interview with Bo it was said that there were no civvies. im not positive, but i can find it later. *if u want to look for it urself, it should be under "RECON" on the top bar... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toniezz Posted March 10, 2006 Author Share Posted March 10, 2006 (edited) okay, you found questions for whiteknight, i think in his actual interview with Bo it was said that there were no civvies. im not positive, but i can find it later. *if u want to look for it urself, it should be under "RECON" on the top bar... ← Ok thank you very much Desertranger! I would realy appreciate that! I will have a look at it also! Btw. the answer of whiteknight @ the 'questions for Whiteknight' topic are related to the interview he had in Germany with Bo (which you can find at the 'Recon' bar indeed! Ok, I am lost Edited March 10, 2006 by Toniezz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
=warcloud= Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 (edited) I can tell you that after playing the 360 version of the game, the residents of Mexico City have completely disappeared and there are none to be seen in what is the world's most populous metropolis. ← Does the pc version share the same story line? XBOX360 storyline, taken from teamXBOX360 review A military coup has taken place... The urban areas are the most impressive due to their sheer size and level of detail, and although the streets are barren of pedestrians during this tumultuous time, there are a lot of ambient sound effects in place to suggest some of the population is still around. For instance, on one level of the game, as the Ghosts make their way to town square area, a baby can be heard crying in the distance. Moving closer to the center of the map, the crying becomes louder. Even though we never see the baby, and the crying is irrelevant to the storyline, it’s a nice touch that adds a level of realism to the situation at hand. I’d probably be hiding in a corner of a building somewhere crying if there was a coup d’etat going on too. Some levels also feature a broadcast in Spanish given by the rebel forces that can be heard. While I’m a bit rusty on my high school Spanish classes, I’m guessing it’s some sort of propaganda being issued to keep the locals at bay inside their homes, while the enemy forces continue their efforts to overthrow the government. Are, just found this in GRAW facts, posted by colin. We Share Story/narration with console version. No more. Mission layout and all gameplay is unique to PC. Edited March 10, 2006 by =warcloud= Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marchafb Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 I for one would like to see some civies. I think it adds to the overall gameplay environment. I remember in GR1 the bank map, when the civilians came running down the alley at me and scared the cr@p out of me! If the civilians are not in the game at this point, it's probably too late in the development cycle to add them, but maybe in a patch? One can hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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