Here's why we won't see so much GRAW PC media

[Poita]

Sorry this is a bit long but here goes.

Some great console media is coming out for GRAW 360 now. I'm sure in the next two months before release it will reach saturation point.

My thoughts though is that the pc stuff will be minimal right up until release time and here's why (though i could be wrong, and often are).

I like the docu/movie 'Pirates of silicon valley' staring Noah Wiley' and also the Robert X Cringley docu 'Triumph of the nerds'.

The movie is pretty crap and the docu is aging a bit as it leads us through the corporate genesis and experience of Apple and Microsoft up to the launch of Windows 95. I feel thought that there are lessons learned (indeed created) there by Microsoft that haven't been forgotten in the last decade. Lessons that we the PC GR fans are feeling the knock on effect off today.

Apple had a four year head start on Microsoft (well the launch of the Intel, IBM, MS-Dos 'PC') but MS broke free of IBM/Intel and destroyed Apple and ended up actually investing in Apple to keep it afloat till Moad'ib . . er I mean Steve Jobs came back and i-mac'ed and i-podded Apple back to stardom.

It seems to me that the biggest factors here were A: the Macs high price and more importantly B: the Mac's lack of very many killer apps. Man the Apple, Apple2 combo had four years to take over yet when IBM finally lumbered onto the ‘Personal’ computer scene they swallowed up the market and things got even worse for apple when the clone wars started.

Jobs might have been a visionary but it seems he wasn't big on ancillary or small details. He created great machines without caring if people could afford them or more importantly if there was much in the way of applications to run on them. If Apple had ensured the flow of loads of great apps then the home computing world might be a very different place today.

The IBM compatible had loads of stuff to run, some crap and some great and once Microsoft stole ideas from Apple (who stole them in the first place from Xerox) about GUI then that was all she wrote.

Now fast forward to the PC v Console wars. As far as gaming is concerned the consoles are cheaper; the 360 with peripherals and a couple of games is about a third the cost of a good gaming pc rig. So Bill Gates main concern is not to forget the lesson of the PC v Apple wars. They need to make sure there are as many killer apps (games) for the 360 as possible. The Atari lynx was a great hand held but had limp games, the Jaguar was a decent console but suffered from the same problem. The PS1 demolished all not so much because of the machine which was beautiful for the day but because of the frikkin ace launch games.

Ok so MS is doing a so so job about getting killer apps out there both in terms of quality and launch dates. But their real problem is not the quality, which can always be improved or the launch date releases, which can be made up in the pre PS3 window they have. Their real issue is the fact that a considerable percentage of their 360 customers are going to be pc players.

This demographic is going to be faced with a choice, 'let their ageing (mine is two and half years old now) pc continue to age and switch their finances to a console set up or forget the console world and spend their limited income on upgrading their pc.

I'm a die hard PC gamer and until the consoles get a decent mouse keyboard set up that I can use on my couch and enough games with PC sensibilities I’ll stay gaming at my sore back inducing desk. Others though are not so committed and the couch is very alluring. So what will sway them?

What will sway many of them is what swayed many people in 1984 to say 'I'll take an IBM please' instead of 'I'll take a Mac please'. That is, the amount and especially the quality of apps that can be used with their purchase.

Remember, as I said, MS haven’t forgotten one of the factors that lead to their victory over Apple (who, don't forget, were giants compared to MS prior to 1984). So finally I get to how this relates to GRAW media being released for the PC, or not being released.

If the borderline hoards of pc/console gamers see game media for the pc that is just about as good (or near to) as that for its 360 counterpart then it's likely that many of them will decide to stay put with something tried and tested and spend the $500 dollars they would have used for the 360 on upgrading their PC.

Microsoft must be aware of and in fear of this to some extent. So in as many cases as they can manage I’m sure they are making deals with publishers of games being developed for the 360. Deals that probably give incentives to the publishers that encourage them to focus all their marketing on the 360 version of the game and downplay the PC pre release publicity.

COD2 is a good example. Sure it looks lovely on the 360 but it also looks pretty darn nice on a decent PC rig. There certainly isn't enough of a difference to cause many to pull the old switcheroo. I can't quite remember if the media for the pc release of COD2 was muffled in the way that the media for GRAW PC seems to be but MS must have varying amounts of influence with the different publishers and Activision and UBI soft must have different approaches.

We see this kind of deal being struck all the time. Certain web sites like Gamespot get better media and sooner (which they usually describe perfectly as being ‘exclusive’ as in to exclude others) in exchange for stuff we will never know about and we have to wait while their customers enjoy higher res footage a few days or a week earlier while we get to wait and are left with the grainy stuff. We generally get the good stuff days later. Same thing happens with movie trailers too and even previews of hot new TV shows.

It's obvious that this principle/ business practice has come into play with the release of GRAW media. I don't fault them as they are businessmen and women and they are approaching things as they see being the better business option.

There can be no other explanation though. UBI want to get all camps excited about t their product and for UBI, the more the word gets out the more money they make. The only explanation for them muffling PC media and info about GRAW and letting it flow about GRAW360 is that there is some unseen benefit to them.

My guess is that Microsoft have structured the licensing deal in their favor and also probably offset the cost of UBI's marketing somewhat. There is probably various other sweeteners too that I can't think of.

That’s the way it goes I suppose. It would be nice if they could just be less manipulative and let the market decide who wants what on what platform but at least it looks like we’ll actually be getting a new GR on the PC this time.

For now though I’ll be enjoying the console footage and just imagining it as the PC version.

[connie lingus]

I loved your analysis and followed your line of reasoning all the way up to this point;

"If the borderline hoards of pc/console gamers see game media for the pc that is just about as good (or near to) as that for its 360 counterpart then it's likely that many of them will decide to stay put with something tried and tested and spend the $500 dollars they would have used for the 360 on upgrading their PC."

As I see it the problem, if there is not much difference between console and PC games, then it's because PC games are not being developed separately, but rather largely or wholly ported from 360.

This seems to have happened already with R6LD so far, and I'm afraid it might be a trend. If so, then many PC gamers may as well buy into XBOX 360, because the PC games were dumbed down.

[Colin]

Having games ported from Xbox 360 is fine by me, in the old days no way but now things are changing.

I would have OFP for a start.

Im sorry guys but the argument about porting from Xbox is no longer relevent.

As far as information goes we will be getting a lot more soon.

[Poita]

I didnt mention anything about porting. That was Connies comment and one person doesnt make an argument hehe.

It seems OFP is a rare case of what i requested in my post (console games having PC sensibilities). And GRAW PC (as in an independant and tweaked development) also seem like the exception rather than the norm.

Yeah the whole porting thing is worrying but understandable from a bussiness point of view.

Im sure there will be more PC media coming out but it will be interesing to see how close to the release of GRAW PC my thesis holds out for.

[WhiteKnight77]

Something to think about. With MS taking a hit of $126 per X360, that $399 console is really $499 and for a few bills more, you can buy a PC. It may not be the fastest PC but you can still play some games on it.

I gave up console gaming to game on the PC as I saw better games. If a company cannot develop a game I prefer, I will spend my money elsewhere and play something else. That's the way I see it.

[connie lingus]

The relevence of my concern about porting 360 games to PC is about the gameplay as well as utilizing the PC platform to it's fullest potential, and I don't only mean graphics.

The options and features that many PC games have today, are not just not made for consoles if they are even possible, so a port from a console lowers the bar for PC games.

Show me a serious sim like LOMAC or IL2 on a 360, and I will change my opinion, but until then nothing could be more relevent to me.

[Poita]

I agree Knight and Connie.

PC games just have that something that you don't get on console games and it's not about graphics.

I would realy like to read an article by somene that could deeply and eloquently illustrate the difference between console and pc gaming. I'm afraid I don't think i have the tallent to do justice to such an essay. I find it hard to just sum up exactly what it is that's fundamentally different about console and pc.

It's funny though cause i remember the exact moment this dichotemy occured to me. I was on Tottenham court road in the very late 80's and was standing out side a Virgin Games store looking at a game called 'Truxtan' or something being ran on a tv from a Sega Genesis. Big, loud garish graphics with huge sprites. I hated it and loved everything about the Amiga computer from the game types to the whole 'scene'. Consoles still haven't won me over 16years down the line but i'll be darned if i can put it into words well.

[WhiteKnight77]

This is speculation on my part, but,,,

The fact that there have been no PC related vids leads me to believe that GRIN has produced an awesome game compared to the X360 version and Ubi does not want the PC version to outshine a possible inferior version. Take a look at the supposed release dates. The PC version is about 2 weeks after the console versions.

I challenge Ubi to prove me wrong about this by releasing a PC video for GRAW within a week.

It is of my opinion that Ubi is afraid the PC version will blow the X360 version away. That is the reason for no videos and holding up the release of the PC version when they originally stated a November release for all platforms then pushed all back and now show the PC version to be after the release of the console versions. While the X360 version (the flagship version mind you at least in Ubi's eyes) looks awesome to you, it has different gameplay compared to the PC (more action over tactical/stealthy) version of it.

[bigworm]

funny that I just said on another forum that if the 360 version is or will be AS good as the PC version I'm considering going out and getting a 360 just for GRAW alone.

I was also saying on ubi's RS forum that each year I'm highly anxious to finally give up PC gaming totally and move over to the console side if and ONLY if they start producing the same type of games (same type of gameplay) as on the PCs ie not dumbing everything down.

My computer is also close to 2 years old now in need of a new MB and processor (though I just upgraded the video card)...so I'm right on the borderline of deciding whether to toss that $400-600 to updating my computer or going with a next gen console.

Most likely though I think I'll be just grabbing GRAW on normal xbox first and then probably the PC version if indeed it does live up to all the hidden hype.

[Colin]

It is of my opinion that Ubi is afraid the PC version will blow the X360 version away. That is the reason for no videos and holding up the release of the PC version when they originally stated a November release for all platforms then pushed all back and now show the PC version to be after the release of the console versions.

I thought this was already a forgone conclusion

[WhiteKnight77]

It may have been unsaid previously, but understood to be so. I don't recall saying this myself so I finally did.

The challange still stands. I dare Ubi to have a video by the end of the week showing PC gameplay (minus the "wow" factors) that will blow our socks off to show that they aren't afraid that the PC version is a better version of a game on 4 platforms. I do not think they can do it. Worst part is, if they don't then we know it to be so.

We should be getting just as much media and PR for the PC version as the X360, but,,,

[Papa6]

@whiteknight, Man this suspense is killing me.

@Colin, according to your NDA..when Can you tell us something?

[Poita]

WK i don't really understand the logic of why a company could be afraid of one version of it's game blowing away another version. I mean one version has to be the best but they make money from both versions so it's a win win for them.

I think my theory of a tie in to Microsofts strategy for the 360 is more likely. I always thought that if i were to launch a console i'd offer a waver on licence fees (i dont know how much ms get per game) for all games ready for launch date just to make sure it launched with a massivel library of ready to play games.

A lesson that so many previous consoles and hand helds seem to miss. The Gizmondo being the latest victim of such.

[Ghost_Zulu]

Let me take you down a road, a road where as a child you begin playing consoles. You form great passion, that consoles are the king of video gameing.

One day you hear about a pc game and how good it is. The normal human response is usually, "Consoles rock, pc's stink." But these comments usually come from the lack of research done by the accuser.

So you go back to your console games and one day your thinking to yourself, "I need more!" A voice inside your head tells you to buy a pc. But the negative side of you that is truely intimdated by the sheer power and mechanical abilities of a pc, tells you, your to good for a pc.

Than one day someone gives you an old junker pc, and now the door has opened for you. After trial and error and being ripped off by salesman, that couldn't figure out how to plug in a ethernet adapter, but some how were licensed to work at bestbuy in the computer department. You finally understand how a pc works.

The most important thing about a pc, is that you've learned how to problem solve and build the pc from the ground up. You've expanded your mind and feel like a new man. So when you go out and buy a pc game you feel respected by, "yourself."

You've created your own hobby, yes the pc might show error messages or not turn on. But that's the excitement that you search for, you call it, "Problem solving." That ability to problem solve has now made other things in life alot easier for you.

Your freind finds out your into computers and calls you a nerdy geek. You laugh as he looks at you with his console player smirk. You respond with an example to him. "Hey it's like this, you bought a big wheel and I bought a Harley." He responds, "What do you mean?"

Your big wheel breaks you go get a new one. My Harley breaks I'm smart enough to fix it."

[Cutter]

Very nice Ghost Zulu very nice !! Sounds very familiar

[Poita]

That's some funny shee ite right there Zulu. Can't figure out if it's atrocious prose or genius satire. Either way it was a damn funny read.

[Janie42]

@Ghost Zulu:

... it was a damn funny read...

←

I, too, enjoyed your post... a good analogy & clever!

[Hellcat]

Ghost Zulu, you have indeed described, the seldom travelled and much sought "Path of the User".

Most of my friends are bitter console haters (you know - the good kind of hate) and persistent 'problem solvers', that one day saw the light and liberated selves from the tyrrany of the console.

I think most of us here have had a similar experience.

Think outside the XBOX people!

[ARDelta]

What about the PS2 people? They haven't seen a thing yet. Everything is decidedly geared towards the Xbox.

[insane snyper]

I hate to see a "revival" (more like a continuation) of the console vs PC argument but as I see it there are several compelling arguments for both

Console:

Cheaper

More New Games

PC:

Better Games

Compatibility, Upgradability, etc

Overall Consoles will win that argument, especially if they can get a decent way to control them (honestly how can you be precise with your THUMB!?!?!). But there is one incredibly compelling argument for PCs and that is that PCs dont incorporate all of the proprietary garbage that consoles do.

And I have to suggest that because of this once consoles have completely taken over the game market their prices will skyrocket because what looser wants to go back to playing those ancient games with their terrible graphics like COD2 or FEAR?

[Colin]

My thoughts though is that the pc stuff will be minimal right up until release time and here's why (though i could be wrong, and often are).

I think you will find, you will be wrong.

Good post though.

[Poita]

Thank's.

And, hehe, in this case it's a win win and i hope i am wrong.