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one last question mate. Do they plan to release a demo?

also, tell them I paid to reserve my copy of GRAW already at gamestop. they have a street date of 8 November for GRAW. correct date for the :whistle: US?

the sandbox editor eh? maybe map making will evolve nicely. I'd assume or guess that we can add more than 2 shermanlevels... :ph34r:

Edited by Papa6
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I don't know about a demo though I do hope they release an MP/SP demo all rolled into one, I hate seperate demos really. If RSE can release a combi demo, others should be able to also. This no way reflects any ire at GRIN or is the opinion of GR.net, this is just my opinion only.

I also do not know of the planned release date, but figure a month or so after it enters beta testing for it to go Gold. Best I can tell ya, sorry.

The editor sounds intriuging I admit, if a sandbox type editor, maybe I will start to make maps. :shrug:

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Great report Whiteknight... even got my lobby question answered...

We are getting one similar to GR1 WOO HOO!!! none of that ingame crap between games.

As for likes and dislikes....

No replays i don't like... hopefully if you can release the more info it will be covered better. We bust cheaters with it all the time.

Starforce... arrgh. Will there be a downloadable seperate dedicated server or do we all have to re-purchase the game for our servers and put a stupid key in them. ( I got my GR1 free with a video card purchase for our server and bought my original)

4 man co-op... seems a little bad for the co-opers (thank god i ain't usually)

32man MP... COOL!

medic was implemented correctly, good to hear... stopping the bleeding... but not full healinng was more or less what i had posted about a few times.

health bar... NO! I would rather have a representation of where i am hit, like GR1 does.

Any word on how many kits?

Is there a command map, and will it have grids?

Night vision as stated above?

Kick/Ban ability in game? (not just lobby) and by ip and name?

Minimum requirements? I know my clanmates will need to know if they will have to upgrade before playing.

Thanks for the very detailed report whiteknight. You covered a lot of our questions in now much time. Thanks also to ROCKY for posting the review. Even with these small flaws i mentioned.

With this reassurance, i will probably be purchasing it the day it comes out as opposed to waiting for reviews.

Edited by ROCOAFZ
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WK, I know you have been the driving force behind trying to get GRAW to what we know today. What is your stance now that you have talked with GRIN and seen what will be implemented? Still pushing for any changes or waiting till release to see what made it and what didn't, just wondering.

Michael

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Several of the things I dislike about GRAW looks to be reworked a bit or parts added to add to the game. The biggest gripe I have of Ubi games that have been released recently is Starforce and it looks like that it will not be as bad as previous games had. I hope to know more soon. Bo also told me that a new view is entirely possible to compliment FPWV and possibly appease those who do not like it, but still, not totally confirmed as yet and again, I hope to help get word out about it. One of the other parts is the light bloom and as noted, it is an early build and still have to have optimizations done to textures and Bo did state that they will tone it down some in the future. Time will tell what we get and hopefully, we (and fellow fan sites) will be able to release the news of those features in the future.

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Well Bo did say "Playing together against AI on MP maps is a totally different mode which I can talk about later." He said "Coop" on the SP missions is limited to 4, so hopefully....

Yeah, I saw that and it is what gave me hope. You should try some of teh "teams" games we play on Alpha2.. oddly no one joins red, and we seem to have many blue teams full of people :)

I just hope/presume we will be able to do the same with GR:AW.

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:rofl: First of all I'd like to also thank Whiteknight for giving us that well written report it answered most of my questions, even though it seamed like grin could have answered some of the questions more directly imo. ok now here is what i have to say after reading the report:

Is Starforce copyright protection to be used; Yes

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Will GRAW feature nothing but urban maps or will we have some open terrain to have firefights on?; Yes

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!OOO!OO!O!O!O!O !!!!111!!! Shift !!!!!!!

How many players are supported for Coop games?; 2 Maybe 4

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

What about replays?; No

NOOOOO! ok, err.. maybe i can live with it if the pysiques are that good.

4 man single player game

NOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! teh gayness.

First person weapon view only

Alright i like fpwv but i knwo many dont.... so

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If they can fix that short little list they will be greatest devs ever....

Etheir way good report. Now im just waiting for the proof in the pudding.

The rest seems so good, just thoes little bits make me want to cry :'(

That pretty much covers my issues after reading the report. As it stands i really hope they correct the coop/sp team numbers and switching capability, over everything else that i dont like i think this would be my biggest issue with the game as it stands from that report. everything else i'm not fond of with the game can probbably be fixed with mods ie urban maps, futuristic setting chr's weapons etc. but only 4 chrs for sp and coop really doesn't sit too well with me.

Edited by jay316
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Awesome. Well done WK and all the gr.net staff that worked on it.

While I'll agree this may not be the best of news for the Co-op fans I think this is great news for Team vs Team MP (With the exception of no replays. I liked replays).

Thanks too, for including my Question. It wasn't as straight forward an answer as I was hoping for but I think I got what I was looking for out of it. I do wish the game types weren't so hush hush. I'd really like to know if some of the old types are gonna make a come back. Like SAR and Seige. My favorite game type is still C&C which I'm pretty sure won't be there But maybe the FNG crew will be so kind as to remake it for GRAW.

I'm soooo lookin forward to this game.

Thanks again.

Lizard out.

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UBi is keeping quiet on game types as the market is so competitive right now that they do not want to tip their hand. The one TvT game type I was told about, though not actually shown sounds promising really, I may even bemore inclined to try TvT more often. I am a big Coop player which to me is what GR always had it's main strength in, but with this, it will take TvT to a new plateau I believe. Only time will tell.

I do want to note one thing that wasn't in my report, the demo was shown on a laptop if that is a hint at what system specs will be required. Previous statements notwithstanding that can be found elsewhere, GRIN seems to have thought of everyone as far as who or what hardware will be able to play GRAW.

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:thumbsup: WhiteKnight77, Bo Andersson.

This report would not have been possible without Ubisoft :thumbsup:

As you know I am not a sceptic, I have always believed that UBI/GRIN would give us a great game.

What has hapened over the last 3 months just proves the point.

UBI have turned a corner in gaming in general, which is good news for the future.

The real people who are changing the face of UBI are on these and other forums. THE PC CROWD if it was not for you and your posts we would not be having this post :huh:.

So it looks like we are going to get about 80 percent of what we asked for in these forums which is great news.

These are a few of the posts that have lead upto this post and this point in time

What Questions would you ask?

http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=26068

The Coke Movement

http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=26021

Personnel Message to Grin.

http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=26207

Grin Development Feedback Section

http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=26565

A Good Server Browser

http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=26898

What We Want in G.R.A.W.

http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=25531

Some of you will be disapointed about one or two aspects, but please remember that we cant have all we want, it would make the game just unplayable.

I am realy looking forward to this game :santa: Nov/Dec.

This report will mark a day in Ghost Recon that changed policy and Direction.

Well done to all the posters in this and other forums.

Colin

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Just a little Q to WK and to Grin.. if there will only be 4 ppl in the squad in coop! Why not make it possible to have several squads that can work together. If U look at GR many coop games are with 9 and above...

Nice report BTW WK :yes::yes:

Edited by Medic
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Is Starforce copyright protection to be used; Yes

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

mahlzeit!

man, that would be the ultimate game-killer. i'd probably not buy it then.... :nono::o=

please, ubi and grin, do not use this crappy piece of software. PLEASE!

btw: starforce is not a copy-protection, its a nasty pain in the ###### bug. starforce installs itself as device-drivers. whthfu? it waisted my windows once with "toca race driver 2".

[EDIT] i almost forgot: good job wk. i really enjoyed reading the interview.

Edited by Brainman2k
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Great read WK, your write up shows just how much you enjoyed yourself there.

As for FPWV it was in counterstrike and when I moved to GR I noticed the weapon wasnt there for about 5 seconds then I never gave it a second thought, after playing BF2 for 5 seconds I didnt notice that they had a weapons view either, if the games good enough and keeps you on your toes you just dont notice it.

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First of all thx for some REAL info on this baby. We dont need to speculate a lot anymore now.

The only 2 things that bother me a LOT ,like many others are again:

- 2 or 4 players??? whats that for? we are with 10members in the clan ( a small clan compared to others) do we need to run 3 servers to get everybody playing??

The only positive side towards this can be that u get more into 'personal' contact with the 3 others, but according to teamplay and fun it will SUX bigtiome

- No replays.................i do hope they make it cheatfree than :stupid:

Thx again to WK and all who helped getting us this info

Ps: i hope it takes a 'rocking' machine to run this beauty cause......hey u got to go with time guys, i wanna see stunning graphics even better ones than gr1 and realistic ones too so bring on those GPU mhz's

-M-

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The coop limit is my only real concern because it will make it harder to get into games on good servers, and how many can run multiple servers. It seems that the reason is to replicate the SP game in coop, but the larger limit in coop is better to allow more people to play together, better for clans and tounaments, and better if modders ramp up the difficulty in modded missions. On that point, I now wonder if you will even be able to make modded missions for SP or coop, otherwise how would you be able to create superb coop mods like Alpha mod or Tactical Gamer mod. It should be a server admin decision to limit the player limit to 2 or 4 or whatever, the max limit should be at least as much as the original game.

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The coop limit is my only real concern because it will make it harder to get into games on good servers, and how many can run multiple servers. It seems that the reason is to replicate the SP game in coop, but the larger limit in coop is better to allow more people to play together, better for clans and tounaments, and better if modders ramp up the difficulty in modded missions. On that point, I now wonder if you will even be able to make modded missions for SP or coop, otherwise how would you be able to create superb coop mods like Alpha mod or Tactical Gamer mod. It should be a server admin decision to limit the player limit to 2 or 4 or whatever, the max limit should be at least as much as the original game.

I agree & also the only gripe is the switching men option/teams and the amount. The rest isnt much of a problem for me.

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I can't believe the replays would be to big so they had to leave them out...

I believe client-sided Counter Strike 1.6 demos with recorded Comms are ~75 mb for 1 side of 1 map, so 150 mb for 1 complete map.

BUT .. When zipped they're only 20-25% of the orginal size. (~30 mb zipped).

The All-Views-Demo in Counter Strike (HLTV - HalfLife TV) are around 40-50 mb for 1 map (1map is mostly the full match or 50% of the match when they play 2 maps)

Then Doom 3, if i remember right the first demos had no compression at all and there were some problems too, the first demos were almost 1 gb !!! in size. Later the company managed to fix this..

Call of Duty demos for 'Search & Destroy' matches are around 10 mb in size, 'TDM' matches are 15+ mb in size. Size is depends on server fps value and rate.

Ghost Recon 1 "demos" (replays) shows ALL views and a hamburger hill match of 2 hours, 6 on 6 or something is maybe 1 - 1.5 mb in size. The quality of the replays are very poor though, but they were great to store on servers, but having full-quality clientsided replays would've been cool.

(CS Client-demos, Doom3 and CoD ONLY shows YOUR view only, they show what you did very accurately.. If you had a crazy flickshot you would be able to record it with fraps from the demo.. in GR you probably won't even see it was a flickshot on the replays)

Point is... Better to have replays even though they are big (how big are they then??) then no replays at all AKA RvS, Battlefield 1.... I can't say i heard many positive things about the No-Replay feature in those 2 games :)

- Or.. Make an option for Clientsided demos/replays...

The small serversided replays from GR1 were awesome for teambased competition that required tactics.. You could see what the other team did and how they managed to beat you, and you could see what you did wrong.

Hmm.. I don't understand how it can be so big then? I mean.. The replays in GR were exactly like the spectator/observer mode. What you saw in spec-mode, you would see back in the replays.

Same for Call of Duty, if you spectate a player with a very bad connection you would see him warping and "stuttering" on your screen, the same thing is visible for that player if he would check his demo..

So... if i'm correct the Quake 3 engine games build their demos from what the server "saw". I remember shooting a person right on him (on my screen) but i couldn't hit him, when checking the demo i saw i was shooting behind him all the time.. The server determines what comes on the demo apparently, i'm pretty sure .. A lot of things i saw on my screen weren't the same in the demo/replay.

Now.. "with the use of physics in GR3" + "ungodly amounts of data to recreate a replay"... How does this work in Multiplayer then?

The clients get all kinds of info from the server so their game can update all players positions, explosions etc etc on their screen...

Can't you save all the data the server sends into a demo/replay file?

No replays.... Big mistake imo :(

I hope my comment(s) made some sense.. kinda hard to explain :P

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@WK77

Thanks for your report first of all. I can only imagine what your inbox was beginning to look like. :rofl:

I've read the report now a couple of times and for me anyway's the limit of players on MP CO-OP is a no go. I understand where GRIN maybe trying to come from on this issue but when I look at most CO-OP teams, ours included, there are many with 15 or more people. In CO-OP tourney's, where many of us like to go to further our online experience, that means far too many of our team mates have to sit out of one mission or another. The fact that it's coming out on DVD doesn't help either but that was one issue that might have been able to be worked around on my end. The limited number of players for CO-OP however doesn't sound like it's going to be worked around. I read and understood where they are working on new TvT modes but as many who do know me I don't play TvT but on the rarest of occasions and only then with a select group of people for my own personal reasons. The essentally all urban combat is another thing that disappoints me.

My hats off to you Whiteknight. You led what appears to be a somewhat successful campaign, RE: Ghost Recon Classic, to restore some of what made the original great. The nice thing about the free market system is the choices we have and it looks like what I am actually looking for will be out mid summer (now the latest estimate) of next year. Until then I have other opportunities to keep me occupied.

Stout Hearts

|RE|Warhawk

Edited by warhawk
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Dare we roll out some Coca Cola Gifs with "Ghost Recon MP classic" on them ... :ph34r:

I was buzzing to think about playing on Alpha Squad server with spanking new GR3 game (if they support a server for it) ... but now .... hmmm.

Edited by calius
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I just spotted something ....

the last comment about MP COOP :

Playing together against AI on MP maps is a totally different mode which I can talk about later.

So - maybe thats different and would support more players? I assumed "COOP" IS against AI ?? Am I missing something or reading into it too much? :wacko:

Edited by calius
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