Weapon texturing problems

[tmichc 6]

Hello all, I decided to branch out in my quest for creating my own mods to add some weapons and stuff. To get a feel for it all I took created a nice little M4 in Max, with Acog, ANPEQ and an M203. Sounds good so far....I applied maps to each seperate part of the model (main weapon, magazine, M203, ACOG sight, leaf sight, and ANPEQ laser unit) and the maps worked perfectly, even when I merged all of the models into my ubercarbine.max file.

So with all going well, I messed about with sizing, etc and exported using piggyson's tutorial as a guide. The uberweapon.qob was created and I created all the files needed to have it as a specialist kit. However, when I load it up in game, this happens:

Edit: Pic removed

It may be a wee bit dark to see properly, but basically the m4body.rsb overrides all of the other rsbs (acog, magazine, anpeq, etc). Is this because I have them all as individual rsbs files, or is it something else?

By the way, I have all patches applied, have the plugins in Max 4.2 correctly placed (as Para and Marcinko can testify to).

Any help would be greatly appreciated as I'm trying to create something for my own fun before I take a shot at modding properly for GR and Far Cry (when it eventually comes out ), but I'm getting frustrated that the thing's not looking perfect.

Tim

Edited May 6, 2004 by tmichc

[GRT 0]

did you do the unwrap uwv(you might have to add that).which will make it alot easier

[SnowFella 8]

Having different parts of the weapon textured with separate .rsb's shouldn't be a problem. Big qusetion I have is if you collapsed your model down to a single mesh before exporting or not? If you did then this is probably what's causing it, everything gets collapsed down to a single material ID and the whole thing starts using one texture instead of multiple ones.

[tmichc 6]

Thanks for the swift replies guys. The textures were UVW mapped properly, here's a quick view of the weapon in Max:

Edit: Pic Removed

The various bits weren't collapsed into a single mesh as such (i.e. I didn't use the 'Collapse' button in the Utilities menu), but attached to the main body of the weapon using the 'Attach List' command. The Max shot shows the weapon once everything has been attached to the M4 body.

As you can (hopefully) see the maps all look ok. I even checked in Mike Schell's Skinner v1.1 and each texture is referenced in the Material List. All in all I'm a bit confused as to why it's doing what it's doing.

N.B. The weapon is rather high-poly, coming in at just over 5000, is this a possible cause?

Further N.B. This is not my weapon as such, I did not make it. I have no intention of releasing it for any mod or game, I just wanted to see if I could export something properly before attempting my hand at making my own.

Edited May 6, 2004 by tmichc

[GRT 0]

Ive never attached my models together..if i have a m4 and m203 seperate i usually group them together and then export..that always seemed to work for me.

[tmichc 6]

I tried your idea GRT, and came out with this:

[Edit - Removed picture]

Looks weird huh? No idea what the story is there. IN Max everything looks fine, it all works perfectly. However, once I export everything goes a bit pear-shaped. Anyone think what it could be?

Thanks for the ideas/comments so far, it's been helpful.

Tim

Edited April 12, 2004 by tmichc

[SnowFella 8]

hmmm...looks like you all of a sudden have alot of gaps in the model, only times I've seen this is if you export it with the "Weld Vertices" box ticked. Could that be it?

[GRT 0]

that or deleted the faces on there maybe...i never exported with the weld vertice box checked so i never knew if that did anything.

btw..model looks good man

[tmichc 6]

Thanks GRT, wish I could say it was mine, but I can't*. The players of other online FPSs may recognise it though.....

Just a quick update, tried exporting without Welding vertices, grouped instead of attached (as you do it GRT) but still got the same result as you see in the above post.

Will look further into it and IF I arrive at a solution I'll post what had happened.

* BTW, am working on my own M4, but it's too nasty to post at the moment....Anyone know how to reduce the central angle between some diagonals of a Gen-gon and not others ? Trying to create an Aussie M4 like the one here, but in 6.8mm, not 5.56mm.

[Chems 0]

I think you will find that the evil problem of your model becoming see through is because the GR engine doesnt take hi polys in a small shape so thats not your fault. Say if you made your barrel with 18 sides, half the sides would disappear in game. Also, the way that max works is on unique names of your textures, so go in to maxs material editor and check that all the textures have a diffrent name. Then try again. But I belive your problem lies in collapsing the model. Thats not a good idea after texturing.

[tmichc 6]

Ah right, I see what you're saying Chems, and it definately sounds right, the model I've been showing you has (with everything on it) over 5300polys!!

So it'd be a case of optimising it down a peg or two then trying again?

Further to this, since as I said earlier I'm trying to make my own model (spent 6hours all ready, and only got a TMH to show for it, lol), does anyone have a decent High-res picture of the rear of an ELCAN optic (as used by the Canadians, Aussies, etc)?

I have the front, both sides and I think I should be able to create the top part (even have high-res pics of the mounting plate), just missing the rear. Any help would be much appreciated (tried Google, that's how I got the other pics).

Sorry to be such a "me, me, me!!" merchant, but I hope this is also answering questions that may have arisen from others or further down the line.

Tim

[Chems 0]

Im afraid the only way to get rid of this problem is to re make the model, which your already doing. I had the same problem with my sig sauger p228, it was about 2000 polys, hi for a hand gun. And a lot of it didnt show in game. So I started again. The second model was much better and much lower poly, about 800 me thinks.

As for textures, the scope lense shouldnt be to hard to find, try going through retailers sites for a good optic site lense picture. Then for the rest see if you can find a Elcan site. I recommend you only use Google image search to start with, once thats exhausted see what web pages its brought up cause not all the pictures on the page will come up in the image search.

[swartsz 7]

i am not sure what the problem is, but i know it isn't the model itself. I have exported the same model several times without any problems.

[DVS1 0]

@ tmichc

I've experienced the texture problem your talking of buddy after merging another max file e.g. M203 to an M4 etc

I had to open the material editor and re-assign the correct texture to the associated model...only took a couple of clicks of a mouse button but it is a pain in the harris I can tell ya

Hope this helps you in some way buddy, if not drop me a pm and i'll put together a little document to explain better with pics

Laters

p.s good looking model there buddy

[SnowFella 8]

Try this one for the rear of the Elcan sight

Rear view

[Earl 0]

I think you will find that the evil problem of your model becoming see through is because the GR engine doesnt take hi polys in a small shape so thats not your fault. Say if you made your barrel with 18 sides, half the sides would disappear in game. Also, the way that max works is on unique names of your textures, so go in to maxs material editor and check that all the textures have a diffrent name. Then try again. But I belive your problem lies in collapsing the model. Thats not a good idea after texturing.

I've never found poly size to be limited by the GR engine. As others already said, this is usually because Weld Vertices is selected in the export options.

The exporter's default value was set at a time when the models weren't very detailed and the distance was enough to clean up any mistakes (like multiple vertices in the same spot from detached faces).

And the leaf sight for the M203 looks backwards

[Chems 0]

I have, try a 18 sided barrel. But Im not sure if it was with weld on or not.

[Earl 0]

I don't doubt that you had problems, but I think it's just the default number in the Weld Vertices that it probably doing that, which is meaningless really. It was just a number that did what RSE needed at the time, not any absolute limit.

I don't think the actual game engine has any limits like that.

[Chems 0]

Well, its probably best to keep it, cause the exact problem happened with my Sig P228, all the curves on the handle and back became see through in game it was terrible, because I had bent the spline lines so I re made the model and it came out just as good looking but with lower poly count.

[Argyll 1]

You need to select all the vertices (Ctrl-A) and then weld them all together give them all a value of 0.01,then weld!!

After you welded then you can add the smooth mesh modifier!!

this looks like the M4 from America's Army

In which if this is the case you cannot put it into any mods.......

Edited March 13, 2004 by Argyll

[tmichc 6]

You are correct Argyll mate. It's not going in any mods don't worry, if I release a mod, it's going to be all my own work (aside from bits where I have help from others - thanks Chems).

This was just a test using a prebuilt model to see how the whole process works properly (am trying to create a set of about 5 M4 carbines, each one with slight modifications, hence why I'm using the AA weapon - I want to be able to add and subract elements and then export the model, not rebuild it from the ground up every time). It seems that it's not as easy as Piggyson's tutorial would have you believe. I shall persevere, though it may take a while....

Tim

Edit: Sorry if this is a question that has been asked many times before, but when you guys model the lower part, do actually have the hole for the trigger, or do you use an alpha channel in the texture to show the hole where the trigger is?

Edited March 13, 2004 by tmichc

[tmichc 6]

Ok, here's an early stage sample of the front end, but it doesn't look quite right, especially with that weird hole....Any suggestions on what to do? Also, how do you create the curve on top of the front iron sight? A Boolean operation?

Edit2: Removed Pic

Any tips from you guys out there would be very much appreciated.

@ Earl: You were right mate, it is backwards....ahem

Edit: Added picture.

Edited May 6, 2004 by tmichc

[Chems 0]

To create that curve on top of your iron sight, the simplist way, but more poly hungry is to use the line tool and click the top of the curve, then the bottom of the curve creating 2 points, dont let go of the 2nd click and drag, and you get a curve. Also an easy way is to keep clicking the points round in a curve less polys. And the funny hole, If you go into Material editor (m) and select a colour then find the check box that says 2 sided, you will find that hole looks a bit better.

[tmichc 6]

Ah, ok, just as you suggested for my custom chr Chems. Thanks mate. Just a wee teaser for you folks out there, here's a rough mock-up of one of the M4s I'm trying to create (pics taken from a variety of sources ):

At the moment I'm working on this M4:

I'll post an image from Max once I get it to a suitable stage.

Tim

[tmichc 6]

Ok, quick update. Been having little success with the main body, though I think that's because of the texture I'm using. So, I've started making the attachments that'll go on the body. Here's a quick render of the aimpoint (no particular version, just a cross between various types):

[Edit - Removed pic, see one below for better views]

What do you think so far? Hints and tips much appreciated, as is constructive criticism.

Tim

Edited April 12, 2004 by tmichc