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Scout - 1st Class

Scout - 1st Class (7/13)



  1. Glock 20 10mmAuto, G29 for carry along with a G27 during summer. The 10mm is capable of getting bounced up to some unreal numbers. The loads I use, at SAAMI spec, are near 700 lb/ft of energy for the G20.
  2. I think that Joint Ops, Typhoon Rising tried. I have it and bullet drop is there. Not sure how accurate it is. Drop does become more pronounced as range increases. Bullet drift, left to right with wind, is not in place. And as stated above, I was not aware GR did anything with ballistics other than some terminal energy calculations based upon simple numbers. My statements were real world.
  3. Bullet drop actually starts much sooner that 600 yards. There are several variables to take into consideration. 1) Range at which the rifle has it's zero. Most snipers are not going to zero (dead center bull) at 100 yards. They will do so between 300 and 600 yards, meaning the bullet will be high at all ranges prior to that. Substantially higher. 2) Bullet drop is determined by a combination of bullet wieght, length (thus sectional density) diameter and Ballistic Coefficient (BC, or the ability of a particular design to beat conditions such as wind.) Here is a sample chart for the 7.62x51NATO (308 Win). 308 Ballistics In the chart, this rifle was zeroed at 100 yards, which is not common for a military sniper. It would be for a police sharpshooter. You will notice that next to the range is the designation MOA, or minute of angle. Minute of angle is approximately 1 inch per minute per one hundred yards. It's actually a fraction more, but not enough to matter. This would mean that one MOA at 100 is 1 inch. At 400 yards, one MOA is 4 inches and so on. So looking at 600 yards, the bullet has dropped 13 1/4 MOA. Converted to inches, this is 13.25 x 6 or 79.5 inches, or more than 6 1/2 feet. More than enough to miss completely, much less a central torso or CNS shot for a kill. Drop would have to be factored in to connect with the shot.
  4. At most GR ranges, bullet drop would be fairly small with just about any caliber. Besides, most true snipers zero their scopes at further ranges. They are not doing it for 100 yard shots, like you would find most often with Law Enforcement/SWAT types. Most snipers that I've talked to zero their weapons between 300 and 600 yards. This would mean that any shot taken at less than that would have the bullet impacting high, not low. If they want to get serious in GR2 (I hope they do), they should have a firing range that allows for the zero to be achieved before actual combat conditions exist. That way, you could zero your weapon at a specific distance and then have to calculate bullet drop, wind, etc. accordingly in the field. That would rock. To answer your question, yes, it does feel great. We all load our own ammunition and some of us make our own rifles (true action, chamber barrel, etc.) The idea of being able to do all this and get it to work at 1000 yards is facinating to me and a great deal of fun. One of our favorite things to do is "bust pigeons" (clay pigeons) at 1000 yards. They are about 4 inches wide. We place several on a hillside and take shots at them. After a couple sighters, We can normally hit them most of the time. It's a great feeling. These rifles are capable of less than 5 inch groups for five shots at that distance.
  5. Projectile, Yep, magazine looks perfect. The images I sent you a while back are with 20 rounders, which allow the shooter to go prone and flush with the ground much more readily that a 30 rounder. The optics that are mounted on the rifle are a bit more high powered. It either wears a Leupold 6.5x20 power 50mm mildot or a Bushnell Elite 4200 6x24 power 40mm mildot. It usually has the 4200 on it, which gathers light as well as the Leupold. Optics mount will be an Armalite 1 piece. I just sent Projectile images of the collapsed Harris bipod today.
  6. Chems, I did my playing around in 1000 yard competition. For the most part, we had two camps. The lighter and fast as heck crowd (6.5x284, etc.) and the not quite as fast but heavy crowd (300 Winchester Magnum, 300 Weatherby, 7mm Remington, etc.) I've always been in the second camp for one reason; consistancy. On a calm day, it is very hard to beat the fast as heck cartridges. They get down range very quickly and honestly are not as prone to human error because of it. The problem is, there are very few calm days. Wind conditions almost always exist at some point during the bullets' 1.5 to 2 second period of flight. We normally watched conditions at 400 yards more than any other. Your bullet is starting to move to it's highest point of flight (Actually around 600 yards at that range) and is most impacted by conditions there. Lighter bullets move more in the wind. Wind conditions and even direction can change several times at 1000 yards (nearly 2/3rds of a mile.) You have to pick the privailing condition and shoot past it. On windy days, the 30 caliber magnums ruled the day. The 220 grain bullet could take quite a bit of conditions before it became a problem. Heavy bullets almost always won the aggregates for the year. As stated by another person above, the average non-trained hunter can hit a target at 200 yards with a high powered rifle using optics. The bullet does not move much. The magic numbers start past around 300. The 5.56 can be effectively used out to around 400 yards but can be accurate much further. The issue is energy remaining. The 5.56 does most of it's damage by fragmentation. Something it won't do past 200 yards anyway. I've killed rodents (groundhogs) with my accurized AR15 out just past 425 yards. The 5.56 can be a great counter sniper / urban round out to about 300 +. 300 yards is longer than most folks think. With regard to rain, I have shot in it. I did notice something. The impact of my first couple rounds at 1000 yards was effectively the same location as when it was not raining. This was with no optical adjustment between rain and no rain. The running concensus is, despite rumor, rain has no measurable effect on bullet trajectory. Heat (mirage) and lighting conditions play a big part. Mirage occurs when a combination of heat/moisture exist to such an extent that the optical picture appears to move like water. There are benefits but you have to be able to read them. Mirage tends to move with the wind and vibrates at a certain speed based upon wind speed. Most snipers are trained to use mirage to determine wind direction and speed. If serious mirage is present, you have to back optical magnification down. Magnifying mirage just make mirage look worse. You have to back down magnification until it appears somewhat calm down the optics. Lighting conditions play a part due to depth perception. If a cloud happens to pass over your target area at that distance, it can cause your perception of depth to change. This normally causes the bullet to hit either high at 12 oclock or low at six oclock. It changes bullet impact by as much as a foot at 1000 yards. I enjoy doing it as there is a true science to all of this. It's quite a bit of fun.
  7. I've heard of them coming in a few lengths but yes, always shorter than the stock SR25. Chems, just posted my 2 cents worth in the thread you mentioned. Nice to talk to you again Projectile, Do you want the bipod mounted or stand alone? Either way is fine
  8. Yes, it can. I've seen rifles shoot one third MOA on $500 Savage rifles and custom Shilen Match barrels shoot so - so. It's luck of the draw sometimes, with the high end custom barrel makers getting it right the vast majority of the time. You can still get a bad one from a good maker, but it's not common. The SR25 used two main barrel makers. Mike Rock and Boots Obermeyer. Obermeyer collaborated with Remington to make the current Mod 11 barrel. Both rifles are 5R configuration. In large part, they use the same type of manufacturing process for both the SR25 and Mod11. I'd get the SR25 and put the rest of the money in training and ammo. The current generation of AR10Ts use Armalites own barrels and Lothar Walther. All of the above makers put out top notch barrels.
  9. The SR25 and Mod 11 (SR25 Mod 11 M0) are effecively the same weapon. One is a rifle only (SR25) and the other a full weapons system based around slightly modified SR25. Barrel length, RAS, etc. The Mod 11 is available to civilians in the US but I don't think I'd pay twice the price for a weapon that buys me nothing. Accuracy will be identical for all practical purposes. The only thing I would like to see is a schematic for the Mod 11 chamber. I have not been able to determine if they have changed chamber dimensions. If they opened up the throat a little, they may have solved any issues with the weapon being particular about the ammunition used.
  10. Nope, the AR15 and SR25 have one major difference, the cartridge used. This obviously makes the SR25 larger in all areas. One uses the 5.56, the SR25 the 7.62x51. Both were designed by the same man, Eugene Stoner. Reed Knight is a highly respected individual but he did indeed get the design from Stoner and the AR10. I've fired several hundred rounds out of SR25 Match rifles, which are essentially the Mod 11 that was built to meet a SpecOps requirement. They are pretty much the same rifle except for the trim thats attached and the normal Government contract markup. The SR25 is an accurate rifle and should be as they cost from $3000 (SR25 Match, no optics) to the Mod 11 at better than $7000 (Full package, including optics.) The accuracy difference between the SR25 Match and an AR10 (From which it was derived) is not measurable (In the AR10s current Match form.) The "problems" SpecOps found with the SR25 that were previously stated in this thread are true. Two problems exist, one operational, one not. Knights production line was not capable of handling the demand placed upon it by the onset of recent conflicts. They could not produce enough, thus requiring the military to look at alternatives. This is not a bad thing as weapons systems that are fully capable of supporting the mission would now get live trials. The AR10Ts came out as did some other custom rifles. Barrett is getting the most time with the long distances available in Afghanistan and Iraq. They have been around a while now but newer variants are starting to show up. The second problem is that the chamber dimensions used for the SR25 are a bit tight. This normally contributes to accuracy ( to a point ) but also makes a weapons system less tolerant of dirt/dust. The SR25 has experienced some issues with jamming and failure to feed. I'm sure they will deal with this soon.
  11. The SPR is nothing but an AR15 with a RAS that fires heavy bullets. The 77 grain Sierra Matchking now has an NSN (National Stock Number) and is normally used in this rifle. The heavier bullet allows for slightly longer shots than the normal loadout and uses a far better bullet in the Sierra. It's still the same cartridge, just a somewhat heavier bullet. I've seen barrel lengths anywhere from 16 to 24 inches on them. 18 appears to be about standard. They can be made for civilians by the original equipment manufacturer. Cost is about $1600 without optics. I like a longer barrel. Helps with velocity. The factory produced Varminter shown in this thread is a bit unusual as it will outshoot most custom rifles. Average five shot 100 yard group can be covered by a nickel all day long. It has taken groundhogs at just over 400 yards easily.
  12. Special Forces do use SR25 (Knights Armament) and AR10T (Limited numbers, but are in place.) Both of these rifles are 7.62x51 (308 Winchester.) The rifle that projectile has here is a 24" inch long barreled AR15 that is accurized. Probably the most accurate non-custom factory AR15 currently being produced. It is in caliber 5.56 (223 Remington.) The full name is the Bushmaster 24FV Varminter. It's been known to be used in law enforcement as a counter sniper rifle. The SR25/AR10 and AR15 have roots in the same family. The AR10 was first, followed by the AR15/18 and then the SR25. The SR25 was largely copied from the AR10. The AR10s bolt/carrier group is identical to that of the AR15 except for size. It's much larger to accomodate the larger 7.62 case and associated recoil. Accurized AR15s are much more common in SWAT/Law Enforcement circles where over penetration is an issue. In urban environments (Raven Shield, etc.) an accurized AR15 would be the better choice. Recoil is very low, allowing fast followup shots. At the ranges shown in Raven Shield, the AR15 would be deadly. The SR25/AR10 would work well out past 600 yards.
  13. Glocks are actually full time double action. The striker is pulled half way back at all times. When the user pulls the trigger, the striker goes the remainder of the way back until the sear releases and fires the round. It's full time DA that feels like single action. If you add a 3.5 pound connector, the trigger on Glocks get pretty nice.
  14. If you can find one, which is hard to do in some areas, grab it. For under 200 bucks, you get a card that can be overclocked or even modified to 9700 power levels. The 9500 is nothing more than a 9700 with a few internal switches turned off. There was a "soft mod" a while back that could bump it up to 9700 specs. You may want to run over to rage3d.com to find out about it. For under 200 bucks, there is not a card around that can touch the 9500.
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