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Takedown: Red Sabre Steam Pre Order available!


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Cool cool! Those were pretty much the answers I was hoping for! Especially cool is six maps, and it looks like they're only showing two or three; so there will be surprise content just like the R6 games -- that much imho is very good marketing in avoiding over-exposing the game's content. Any howdy thanks for your post, I'm off to bed, another long day tomorrow...

Edit: One thing Serellan obviously will sorely lack for is a marketing budget; that's hardly a bad thing as who would want to see them do the 20:1 marketing:development budgeting we see from some of the largest publishers. That said everything Fans do to help bring this game to the largest audience will be a boon.

One thing Serellan could offer would be to let anyone that has a single license to the game -- including those that are 'gifted' the option to buy an upgrade to a 4 Pack for less then the 4 Pack price; this offers a nice price leverage for gifting after the fact for those that weren't thinking of it at the time they bought that would bring more Players to the game.

Edited by 101459
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We always can hope alot of COD players decide they hate perks and kill streaks and buy the game but I think no matter how much it is marketed it will be to a smaller fan base tho. A shame because i think these games make you a better player.

Edited by twcrash
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Got it, played it for a bit, initial impressions based on exclusively single-player:

I'm not that impressed. There's a lot that really shines here, but the utter lack of robust commands for your AI teammates, the really shallow team customization (the requires a lot of forethought, outside of the present mission) and the maddening loadout interface really interfere with my ability to enjoy the game. There needs to be a "save current loadout" button, and the ability to edit the loadout in the mission selection screen, not just from the main menu. There needs to be the ability to order your team to a specific position to e.g. cover you while you disarm the bomb, or to throw a flash bang when you run out.

The game is clearly optimized for online co-op, so the single-player portion seems really tacked on. If I had known, from the outset, that single-player would be so utterly superfluous to Christian's vision as seems evident from this (admittedly brief) playthrough, I might not have supported the Kickstarter.

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Got it as well, oh man, not happy at all... No pre-mission planning ala Rogue Spear, really really bad AI. 5 levels, 5... Couldn't connect with friends on the MP servers. I had a "lost connection" in SP a few times, what the?!? Why it wasn't put on as early access i'll never know, an unfinished product.

If you want a clear picture of it, watch this. It's pretty much the same as my experience

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Yeah not sure what is going on there but I suspect they played with the config files (I was looking through them myself to change the iron soight toggle) you can edit the Ai,Weapons and everything within them. I, along with a few others were in TS yesterday and never had that happen. Just the opposite the AI were too damn good at times.. But other than the connection issue (I worked around it with friends by running the "TakedownGame-Win64-Shipping.exe" ) and we connected after I allowed it to bypass my firewall. The game definitely needs some work no doubt but I remember ArmA 2 not running on Release and Ghost Recon Future Soldier as well so it doesn't surprise. But I see alot of potential, map making, weapon cfgs can be adjusted and yes I even set my own loadouts through a cfg file as well. So it can all be done. Just will take some time to work it out.

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I can say unequivocally I am not disappointed; while the feature limitations and issues mentioned above (as well as others I'd like to see addressed) do present -- I don't think anyone complaining (here or on the Serellan forums) is really considering the full-context of their complaints:

$15.00

The game costs just $15.00

Not four, five, or six times as much like the games many doing the complaining seem to be basing their expectation on; it's a $15.00 game and well below what even well funded 'budget' SKUs retail for.

I'd love to see this game improve, have the features described added, and issues patched; but the only way we'll get there is if Serellan can afford to get the work done, and that means constructive support from Fans that will encourage more sales.

The most important thing of being overlooked is that these guys are working on building the game we want. Sure it has rough edges, a lot of them in fact, but with your support, and help in prioritizing what's really most important I bet they get closer to R6 and OGR then Ubisoft manages to.

Edited by 101459
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I don't think anyone complaining (here or on the Serellan forums) is really considering the full-context of their complaints:

$15.00

The game costs just $15.00

Not four, five, or six times as much like the games many doing the complaining seem to be basing their absurd expectation on; it's a $15.00 game and well below what even well funded 'budget' SKUs retail for.

My frustration was that I kicked Serellan $50 to support the Takedown Kickstarter, because I really wanted a return to Rainbow Six style tactical gaming, not Swat 4 style tactical gaming. I appreciate that this is a process, and I can expect more in the future (hopefully a robust planning phase, or at least better squad control), but the thing is, I didn't get this game for $15. I understand that they're essentially selling the beta (much like Arma 3, which I also got in on), I just wish that it was in my Steam list as 'Takedown - Beta', rather than masquerading as a finished game.

In terms of individual experience (the lone-wolf experience, if you like), the game is everything I hoped it would be. The gameplay is tense, and the equipment is both well differentiated and effective-feeling. The sounds are great and while the visuals are not spectacular, the game isn't ugly either. It has a lot of Rainbow Six's visual style, and I love the incredibly stream-lined interface.

What I want to see in future revisions (in order of priority):

1) The ability to change your loadouts during the planning phase. I read the FAQ, I don't mean during the mission, I mean that after I hear the briefing, but before I click "start", I *need* to be able to modify my loadout. I should not have to quit to the main menu to modify my (or my AI team's) loadout.

2) Total redesign of loadout editing to be similar to that done in e.g. Swat 4, Rainbow Six 3: Raven Shield, or Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter. That is, it should be clear whether or not I've saved the changes I've made, especially in light of the bugs that are occuring with it, and I should be able to easily compare my loadout before the mission with my teammate's loadout without resorting to third-party chat programs or (again) quitting to the main menu.

3) Detailed squad control, so that (for instance) running out of flashbangs doesn't require you to sacrifice your point man for more. Alternately, be upfront about single-player being "just for practice" and eliminate the friendly AI entirely. As it stands, they serve as essentially extra lives, but of varying utility since they all have different (but utterly indistinguishable before hand without a pen and paper to hand while assembling the loadouts) loadouts.

4) The robust planning phase of old-style Rainbow Six.

If I'm harping on the loadout issues a bit, its because its basically the only way to customize your experience (there isn't even graphics customization, and I was under the impression that this is a PC game), and its really poorly executed. I can think of 8 different games that Christian has played (at least 2 of which he actually worked on) that did it better, so I really hope that this is just an interface issue they haven't ironed out yet.

Edited by petsfed
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I understand what your saying and I am sure they appreciated the donation. I think the loadouts are fine. I set mine up with 4 variants which i don't see a need to use anything else. I don't use a shotgun so i have 2 cqb sets and a rifleman and sniper setup. Which seems to work out fine for me. One thing about too many choices you get the guys who sit in the armory for 15 minutes deciding what to use. I am sure all of us have had someone in GR or ArmA do that many O times lol. I think we sit back and let them work out the kinks and we will be fine.

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petsfed I understand your beef, I really do; your complaints are valid. However, I don't think expectations that the game is going to be at feature parity with our favorite 'AAA' games, on a short development schedule (shorter then what we've seen even from RSE and Ubisoft) with fewer people working on the game, for less money -- is realistic...

I'm hoping that Fans (like us) 'get it' not just literally and pay for games like Takedown, but get it in the sense that we're willing to fund this game and others like it to the cost of an 'AAA' title or a even little more to get it where we want it, and are willing to wait or contribute; as anything worth having is worth waiting for or making yourself.

That said there are a lot of things I'd rather they finished first; I'd much rather see more polished game mechanics then the the elaborate FPP shooting machinery of ironsights, FP animations etc. -- I actually liked R6 or SOAF's unique player perspective and aiming systems. That said I think Serellan do have some of the most expensive work done (with perhaps the exception of animation assets).

While I don't know if Serellan will in fact ever deliver the modern incarnation if Tactical Realism we all hope for; I think it sets guidance for others that are making a similar effort like Insurgency, SpecWAR and Ground Branch. With a little more realism added to our expectations I think eventually we'll get there: Takedown, Insurgency, SpecWAR and Ground Branch will arrive more finished, satisfying and sooner then any of the next three 'Clancy' titles that will promise as much...

Edited by 101459
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I'll post a small review from my experience...

Gameplay is fun. Intense at time and in TVT you can even run around Call of duty style if you wish. Will be great for matching.

Here is what i don't like. I haven't found a way to mute a player. Had a few 10 year olds repeativly testing the voice thinking it was funny. If anyone knows how to mute one player i would be greatful.

And the server list... not reporting how many players in a server and very few servers.

It's rough and beta like but i didn't experience and horrendous lag which is great since you are playing off the hosts's pc.

Also i am running this in WIndows 8 pro 64 bit. Only issue is sometimes if i close out it remains in the background and won't let you start the game up untill you end the takedown process.

Looking forward to patches to make this game better.

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One thing about too many choices you get the guys who sit in the armory for 15 minutes deciding what to use. I am sure all of us have had someone in GR or ArmA do that many O times lol.

I just don't understand how a design choice meant specifically to discourage that sort of behavior in multiplayer has any sort of use in the single-player experience, except perhaps because the single-player is in fact just tacked on training, in which case throw out the quasi-singleplayer experience and sell it as just a multiplayer shooter with off-line "training". I'm frustrated that Serellan wasn't up-front about that design choice in the first place.

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I just don't understand how a design choice meant specifically to discourage that sort of behavior in multiplayer has any sort of use in the single-player experience,

Who says it was meant to discourage anything. I think we all assume that because WE want something it was meant to be there. I looked over most of the details about loadouts and I never found anything that even remotely indicated that there would be some type of unlimited loadout settings. Contrary I found lots of quotes stating you would have a few loadouts that would be customizable. But nowhere have i found what people are complaining about. I think we made alot of assumptions and expected that because we thought it would have it that it actually would. I mean what is good for you wont be good for someone else. there are at least 5 assault rifles, 2 pistols, 3 or 4 SMGS and at least one shotgun and a sniper rifle (not including you can make a couple M4 and Ak variants. So again I am not sure. I am ok with the 4. Some wont be ok unless theres 50 and 500 weapons to choose from so who decides what is good? I say the guy who made it.

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Im not touching this topic with a 10ft pole....

You just did you posted here...

:cowboy:

actually... I see a lot of modding potential. I would buy the game if the SDK comes with a lot of support.

I feature the fellers at Serellan get that they're running a very tight ship, resource limited in terms of just about everything with respect to time, money, manpower, market awareness, and that an MDK/SDK will be fairly crucial in leveraging the fanbase they do have.

If not...

Edited by 101459
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You're right. A feature that has been present in virtually every single-player tactical shooter since Rainbow Six is not something that a single-player tactical shooter player can expect (the only example of a similar, but still more robust, loadout restriction was Sum Of All Fears). The system in place makes perfect sense for a multiplayer specific tactical shooter. Infiltration, the mod for Unreal Tournament, used a very similar system, and it made sense for that setting, since there was absolutely no single player. Since I only play single-player, that sort of deliberate rush to get players into the action seems antithetical to the whole "thinking man's shooter" ethos. And again, the frustration is with a deliberately-multi-player move leveraged onto an advertised single-player mode. Cutout the "singleplayer", call it "offline training" and my criticism evaporates.

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I don't think they ever meant this to be considered a strong SP game. I mean every in game video footage I watched Christian states "Winning this single player is impossible" So I am assuming they always meant for you to play this with multiple players and various loadouts.

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To make a comparison if I may, Breach, a game that came out in '11 was only 10 bux, was created by an even more lucrative studio, had twice as many features including fully destructible terrain, and half as many problems. However, due to their lack of support after launch, they inevitably ended up going out of business, their game got pulled from Steam and everyone disappeared. I tend to fear the worst when it comes to cheap little indie shooters like these b/c I've seen this too many times. I'm hoping I'm wrong about Serellan, but I fear they may end up pulling the same maneuver. Let's all just face it. The tactical shooter isn't Jesus, and it's not coming back. It's dead and gone and may it rest in peace.

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I bought it played it and currently am waiting for it to be desperately patched !

Its very buggy at the moment, so DO NOT buy it yet.

Many people cannot host their own servers and servers not appearing in the game lists etc.

Have only been able to play multiplayer via use of Hamachi and using eachothers IP addresses.

Other than that, its very playable and Hard to boot.

The maps are very good but graphics of the characters are very much like Gr......too much in fact.

Ground Branch will be the one to knock em all for six, but for now this ones playable in coop for up to 6 players, but wait for the patch before you buy otherwise you will be bitterly disappointed.

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You don't need hamachi, just alt tab out and use steams server browser.

Many of the issues mentioned above are being addressed in upcoming patches. I know they are compiling a hit list based on eliminating bugs and adding features.

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You don't need hamachi, just alt tab out and use steams server browser.

Many of the issues mentioned above are being addressed in upcoming patches. I know they are compiling a hit list based on eliminating bugs and adding features.

Rocky you misunderstood me.

You cant play with friends via the steam server as your server doesn't appear in the internet server list.......ours kept appearing in the LAN list !....even though it was setup as an internet server at first, then we went to direct ip (using Hamachi) as this is the only we could play a match together.

They still have not fixed that as of this time I am typing this.

Edited by CJo1964
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