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Vista Sales are slow....

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I keep reading how slow Vista sales are, and now that the figures don't compare to XP sales.

There are probably about half a dozen good reasons why this is, but I just wonder if the main reason is that *gasp* people are happy with XP!

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For me it is simular to the blue ray/high-def DVD issue, sure the new generations are better, but not that much better that I feel any desire to upgrade.

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Costs too much to upgrade to Vista right now. I'll probably wait until I build a new PC to make the change. I just have too much stuff on this laptop, and making the move would be a giant PITA.

I'm sure most people are the same way. To a certain extent.

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When XP came out, the only other options were 98, WinMe, and Win2K. We all know about the stability issues of Win9x, and Win2K just wasn't as user/gamer friendly. WinXP was a no brainer. There is no compelling reason for ppl to upgrade to Vista.

I've been running Vista, and I don't recommend it to most people now unless they are getting a new computer.

What makes me laugh is those ppl with GF8800's who are making a big fuss about the Nvidia's poor Vista drivers. If they were gamers trying to get the best performance, they wouldn't be bothering trying to game on Vista in the first place. Sheesh. :rolleyes:

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I agree with this. there's no reason for me to upgrade to Vista. The time will come that the PC community will have to make a decision; to upgrade to Vista or stay with XP. but if you stay with XP, will you fall behind in the gaming arena? perhaps according to MS as DX10 is supposed to be the future of gaming.

But I've seen and this and it's a bit comical that, some are looking already to the NEXT Microsoft OS. Thsi new OS currently named Vienna

This tells me not to get too excited about Vista. I know i got a free copy of Vista Business, but damn it doesn't run well on my PC for some reason. I'm getting a 70-100% CPU usage and no process is showing what offending process is causing this.

But with what I've said and the inflated arsed price tag for this OS, Vista will make MS fall flat on it's face. :D

Most folks see NO reason to upgrade to Vista when they are happy with WinXP. But if gaming for example, is as MS wants XP gamers are in the dark unless certain PC gaming devs make games exclusively for XP or Vista. gone are the days of games being labelled "For: 98SE,ME,XP.. Now it will be "Vista ONLY" leaving XP users out in the cold.

atleast that's my perception :rocky:

Added thought: why is it that Vista's release offers barely any drivers when, XP had drivers already to run(available) at release? I'm thinking of Vista as the Windows ME debacle >_<

-Papa6

P.S.

among other ideas, Microsoft is investigating a pie menu-type circular interface, similar in function to Apple's dock feature.

Well, I guess this is proof that MS does try to copy Apple. no creativity or imagination on MS's part anymore.

Edited by Papa6

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Slow sales:

http://computerworld.com/action/article.do...;intsrc=hm_list

Vista RAM Requirements, 4GB sound enough for you?:

http://www.computerworld.com/action/articl...ticleId=9011523

No Nvidia Drivers:

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=37396

IE7 Security Issues:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/02/20/vi...urity_oversold/

...

Am I biased? Sure, but still... crazy articles eh? ;)

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I think it will just take a bit of time. Just wait until the Dells and HPs of the world really throw their weight behind it. Then everything will be Vista-fied. Microsoft isn't concerned with people upgrading near as much as they just want to make sure everybody who buys an OEM machine gets a nice shiny copy of Vista on it.

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with the delays of vista and the technologies that would make Vista a truly a new innovative OS were scrapped by Microsofts in-ability to get the winfs filesystem to work.

Vista was perhaps an example of false expectations that might never pan out.

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Vista is actually a pretty cool O/S

I'm liking the sidebar gadgets alot and i usually hate that kind of thing. Performance... no cpu usage for me when idle and average about the same as XP

Ram... 4gb is an over estimate. 2 is more realistic. Vista caches everything in ram. Outlook for example since i use it a lot is cached in memory. no load time... instantly open when i click on it. This is why it shows 23mb of ram free. it tracks what you use and precaches it when your computer is idle.

troubleshooting is easy also. There is a log for everything. I can see what files are accessing my hard drive, memory, and cpu + percentage of each resource that file is using and it's location. (to see this go to your taskmanager , click performance then resource monitor. Double click cpu for example or disk. (the words not the graphs))

Also have any of you read of ready boost? take a usb flash drive and use it as ram such as a 2gb. for 80$ you can theroetically add 2gb of ram to your pc. This will be great for laptop users with only 2 dimm slots.

IE7 is in Xp also, and yes firefox has issues also... but will this possible problem every happen to you? i doubt it.

Nvidia has whql drivers that work for a lot of games... unfortunatly at the moment not GRAW althogh i am testing the lastest tonight. Creative drivers are beta but functional. Razer... my fav mouse release working vista drivers a week after the vista release. My hats are off to them as my diamondback works well.

Vista also uses shadow copying like windows 2003 server. Here is a big advantage to small businesses without server. it saves revisions of each file changed. it uses 15% of your drive (non adjustable) to do this. You can revert back to a previous version from 1 hour ago to 2 weeks. That is a saviour to businesses and it's forced so no user is shutting it off. to see this... right click any file or folder, left click properties ... go to previous versions and choose the revision you want to restore.

Vista itself is EXTREMELY stable... but as stated some software doesn't work. examples are nero 6 (you must have 7) but vista has extensive burning capabilities built in for cd and dvd. Norton 2007 will not work unless you get the patch from symantec 1st is another example. I would say in 3 months it should be ready for mainstream as long as the hardware manufactures get there drivers up to date.

Oh and windows defender is built in to help protect against malware.

As for sales. Price is one reason. 2 is rumored and true incompatibilites. 3 most businiess don't change for up to 1 year or if the previous operating system can no longer be purchased.

My biggest complaint right now though is graw although the armed assault demo in all it's buggyness runs the same.

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I would love to upgrade to Vista, but my problems stem from driver support (specifically nVidia and Creative) and the inability for some games I play to run on the OS. If it wasn't for those 2 things I would have bought Vista weeks ago.

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actually nutlink hit the nail on the head. aside from the gaming, it appears that the only copies of vista that are really selling are those that come with PC's.

Roco has a point to,,Vista DOES look cool. But then on the other hand, every article I've read, the forum posts I've seen and read all say the same thing, Why should I upgrade when I'm perfectly happy with XP?

I'll use my case as an example. MS released that upgrade tool to determine whether ones PC can run Windows Vista? you know what I'm talking about right? well that exact tool, which was the latest version told me there would be no issues. but excuse me when I call bulls****! I installed my free Vista business and it runs for sure but I look at my task manager and my CPU (AMD64 3700+ San Diego core) is running at a staggering 70 - 100% usage. So beung the investigative kinda guy I am, I checked my processes by user. nothing in there tells me what's causing the high usage.

So all in all, this tells me Vista is pure crap. at first i liked it, but now I don't. every previous version of Windows installed and ran straight out of the box, drivers support was there upon release and the only reason I upgraded my PC was to be able to game better. but now? I need to upgrade just to run the damn OS? This is a joke! :angry:

Microsoft is playing RIGHT into the hands of PC makers. Wanna run vista? gotta buy a new PC! aside from the drivers issue, Everything that Vista offers, we have already with XP. But that's not all. The next version aptly named Vienna is currently being worked on. but MS says NOTHING about it so it won't hurt sales of Vista.

So, while Vista does look good, it is worthless in terms of use. It reminds me of the days of Windows Me. A real let down. >_< plus WinXP has SP3 coming out this year or the next.

My Vote: Stick with XP! :thumbsup:

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actually nutlink hit the nail on the head. aside from the gaming, it appears that the only copies of vista that are really selling are those that come with PC's.

Roco has a point to,,Vista DOES look cool. But then on the other hand, every article I've read, the forum posts I've seen and read all say the same thing, Why should I upgrade when I'm perfectly happy with XP?

I'll use my case as an example. MS released that upgrade tool to determine whether ones PC can run Windows Vista? you know what I'm talking about right? well that exact tool, which was the latest version told me there would be no issues. but excuse me when I call bulls****! I installed my free Vista business and it runs for sure but I look at my task manager and my CPU (AMD64 3700+ San Diego core) is running at a staggering 70 - 100% usage. So beung the investigative kinda guy I am, I checked my processes by user. nothing in there tells me what's causing the high usage.

So all in all, this tells me Vista is pure crap. at first i liked it, but now I don't. every previous version of Windows installed and ran straight out of the box, drivers support was there upon release and the only reason I upgraded my PC was to be able to game better. but now? I need to upgrade just to run the damn OS? This is a joke! :angry:

Microsoft is playing RIGHT into the hands of PC makers. Wanna run vista? gotta buy a new PC! aside from the drivers issue, Everything that Vista offers, we have already with XP. But that's not all. The next version aptly named Vienna is currently being worked on. but MS says NOTHING about it so it won't hurt sales of Vista.

So, while Vista does look good, it is worthless in terms of use. It reminds me of the days of Windows Me. A real let down. >_< plus WinXP has SP3 coming out this year or the next.

My Vote: Stick with XP! :thumbsup:

Yes I am sticking with XP right now, I would like to have a test copy of Vista but right now I consider Vista virus like software, untested by public and risky.

Although I do repect Roco's review.

Death

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actually nutlink hit the nail on the head. aside from the gaming, it appears that the only copies of vista that are really selling are those that come with PC's.

Roco has a point to,,Vista DOES look cool. But then on the other hand, every article I've read, the forum posts I've seen and read all say the same thing, Why should I upgrade when I'm perfectly happy with XP?

I'll use my case as an example. MS released that upgrade tool to determine whether ones PC can run Windows Vista? you know what I'm talking about right? well that exact tool, which was the latest version told me there would be no issues. but excuse me when I call bulls****! I installed my free Vista business and it runs for sure but I look at my task manager and my CPU (AMD64 3700+ San Diego core) is running at a staggering 70 - 100% usage. So beung the investigative kinda guy I am, I checked my processes by user. nothing in there tells me what's causing the high usage.

So all in all, this tells me Vista is pure crap. at first i liked it, but now I don't. every previous version of Windows installed and ran straight out of the box, drivers support was there upon release and the only reason I upgraded my PC was to be able to game better. but now? I need to upgrade just to run the damn OS? This is a joke! :angry:

Microsoft is playing RIGHT into the hands of PC makers. Wanna run vista? gotta buy a new PC! aside from the drivers issue, Everything that Vista offers, we have already with XP. But that's not all. The next version aptly named Vienna is currently being worked on. but MS says NOTHING about it so it won't hurt sales of Vista.

So, while Vista does look good, it is worthless in terms of use. It reminds me of the days of Windows Me. A real let down. >_< plus WinXP has SP3 coming out this year or the next.

My Vote: Stick with XP! :thumbsup:

The upgrade advisor was right. Vista does run well on your pc. They didn't say the games would though ;)

Creative is close. Nvidia is also... althought not for GRAW. Like i said some games to work well in it.

Deathdealer.... i don't think it was that it wasn't untested. I think MS said. Screw the old unsafe apps. It's time to either get your installers or drivers right, or don't play on the new O/S

I'm testing Vista still with each driver revision... but this weekend my 2nd drive will have xp pro for gaming, ans vista on my primary for testing in games, e-mail and now my palm pilot syncs with outlook 2007 woot (thank you palm) until someone makes my GRAW run correctly rather creative nvidia or a vista compatibility patch by MS or Grin.

For the mainstream non techies... i say give Vista 2 more months then check in.

Oh and Vista has been in the works for like 10 years lol... Vienna may be in the works but i doubt will see it soon.

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Roco, the OS runs yes, but My processor runs 70-100% usage whereas XP runs at 7-10% as low as 2% in most cases. the kernel in vista uses around 20% average or constant

But I can live without Vista. :thumbsup:

-Papa6

Edited by Papa6

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Roco, the OS runs yes, but My processor runs 70-100% usage whereas XP runs at 7-10% as low as 2% in most cases. the kernel in vista uses around 20% average or constant

But I can live without Vista. :thumbsup:

-Papa6

Papa... something is wrong then... check your resource monitor (task manager resource monitor, click on cpu.) It will tell you the file, what it is and the exact location. On my p4 right now i'm running at 0-2% with 2GB of ram and only a p4 3.0 prescott.

Did you do the straight upgrade or fresh. the difference for me was night and day. some of my old apps wrecked havok when i did the upgrade from xp. (i ignored the warning about symantec and ccouldn't uninstall it and same with nero... lol what do you know MS was right... )

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Yeah Roco i tried both. a frsh install and the upgrade and it ends up the same way both times. so I deleted the Vista partition. But i tried the task manager and the kernel was what concerned me. it eats up about 20% on average.

I'll keep my copy of Vista so when I buy my next PC, i can use it instead.

But I'll be looking ahead to Vienna and let's hope it doesn't have the mind numbing date push backs and technology being removed.

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But I'll be looking ahead to Vienna and let's hope it doesn't have the mind numbing date push backs and technology being removed.

You can bet your booties Vienna will have major slippage and vaporware.

I'm hoping Vista sticks around at least as long as XP has. I'm glad M$ didn't try to release a new OS every 2 years (remember Win95, 98, 98SE, Me, 2K) and XP lasted 5 years.

In any case, every system I am installing Vista on is dual-booting with XP, so that solves a lot of issues with incompatibilities. If I have old software that can't run on Vista, I just boot back into XP. In fact, I was still dual-booting XP with Win98se until about 4 years ago.

BTW, did any of you take advantage of the Vista family offer? I bought 2 extra Home Premium licenses for US$50 each.

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/...lydiscount.mspx

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But I'll be looking ahead to Vienna and let's hope it doesn't have the mind numbing date push backs and technology being removed.

You can bet your booties Vienna will have major slippage and vaporware.

I'm hoping Vista sticks around at least as long as XP has. I'm glad M$ didn't try to release a new OS every 2 years (remember Win95, 98, 98SE, Me, 2K) and XP lasted 5 years.

In any case, every system I am installing Vista on is dual-booting with XP, so that solves a lot of issues with incompatibilities. If I have old software that can't run on Vista, I just boot back into XP. In fact, I was still dual-booting XP with Win98se until about 4 years ago.

BTW, did any of you take advantage of the Vista family offer? I bought 2 extra Home Premium licenses for US$50 each.

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/...lydiscount.mspx

Good call Cr6, didn't know about that deal... Your 1st pc must have ultimate though. Not sure if this works for OEM licensing either... and retail... well ultimate is really expensive for the average user.

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There is no compelling reason for ppl to upgrade to Vista.

:yes: I didn't see anything in Vista that would make me want to switch from XP.

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There is no compelling reason for ppl to upgrade to Vista.

:yes: I didn't see anything in Vista that would make me want to switch from XP.

I'll list a few of the goods over xp. There are always compatibility issues though but when they are resolved you may want to.

#1 Ready boost / Ready Drive. use a USB key as memory or even an sd card. Cheap and easy to install from the outside and boosts a 70% increase compared to the same amound of ram. Will be great for laptops that only take 2 dimms

#2 Complete PC backup. Using shadowcopy it can back up to a usb drive of the same size or greater live with programs even open. Now this gets better. The file is a Virtual PC file. If your computer goes down you can download virual pc to any XP or Vista pc and run your o/s print your documents or such from within virtual PC while the pc is being repaired... then restore to that broken pc with all data intact + anything you changed or worked in while in virtual PC. We just learned this at an MS TS2 event Tues last week. That alone is Awesome!!! btw virtual pc is free

#3 Shadow copies. Any file changes you make are backed up. it uses 15% of your drive (non adjustable) to do this.

#4 Program caching. The programs you use the most are kept in ram. They will start instantly with no drive usage.

#5 Not really a good reason but Aero looks cool

#6 Advanced diagnostics. With the Resource monitor you can see not only what is system processes... but what is using the most ram, most network, most drive activity... LIVE!

#7 Advanced search. Right above where start was in XP is a search. type the 1st letter of any program or doc and it will be listed above. Narrow it by typing more. If i want Microsoft Paint, i click pa and select it. instantly.

#8 Down the road DirectX 10.

#9 this seems small but renaming doesn't auto highlight extension. How many times have you tried to rename a doc only to change it to an unknown extension because you typed a letter and it removed it. Vista doesn't auto highlight the extension so editing is quicker.

#10 Overall non gaming performance. The O/S itself Rocks. Now only if the drivers would for gaming cards and high end sound cards.

Currently those are some of the major benificial differences.

I'll post more if i see anything else.

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BTW, did any of you take advantage of the Vista family offer? I bought 2 extra Home Premium licenses for US$50 each.

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/...lydiscount.mspx

Good call Cr6, didn't know about that deal... Your 1st pc must have ultimate though. Not sure if this works for OEM licensing either... and retail... well ultimate is really expensive for the average user.

It says you need to buy a "Windows Vista Ultimate retail boxed product" but that could be an upgrade version too. So OEM versions can't be used, and the deal is only in US and Canada.

I usually get OEM versions myself, but it worked out cheaper to get the retail Ultimate upgrade with 2 Home Premium keys special offer (Cdn$300+60+60=$420) vs. three OEM (Cdn$250+137+137=$524). I also got a free MS webcam worth Cdn$70 with the Ultimate upgrade purchase, and $10 off OneCare, so it was pretty worth it.

Only prob is I only have one Vista disc instead of 3, so hopfully it doesn't get too scratched up :P

UPDATE: I read somewhere (can't find the link right now) that after 1 month, Vista is currently installed in about 1% of systems. As an OS, it is in 6th overall place after Win98 :P

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Just tried to (dual boot) install on of the Vista Home Premium keys on a home system I have running XP Pro and it tells me XP Pro can only be upgraded to Business or Ultimate. What???

Fortunately I have an XP Home disc, but that's a wacky upgrade scheme by M$. Just a warning to those of you with XP Pro that you can't upgrade to one of the Vista Home versions. :angry:

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I found this link on one of the pages linked to above. Basically its a long list of reasons not to buy Vista.

The author even recommended considering moving to a Mac instead when "Leopard", the new Mac OS comes out - it's supposed to rock. But I guess his biggest beef against Vista is that it's just not ready for prime time. Obviously, it will be someday but you ought to wait.

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I just built a Core 2 E6400/i965P/1Gig RAM/7100GS system today for a non-gamer friend who mainly surfs and stores his family pics on his rig. When he asked me if he should get XP or Vista, I immediately recommended Vista Home Premium as he doesn't have to worry about game/app incompatiblities, 3D video drivers, and he will not have to worry about MS ending their XP support in 5 years.

I've told most of my friends that have XP that there's no rush to spend the bucks to upgrade right now unless they buy a new system or can take advantage of Vista's functionality like the above case.

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Just tried to (dual boot) install on of the Vista Home Premium keys on a home system I have running XP Pro and it tells me XP Pro can only be upgraded to Business or Ultimate. What???

Fortunately I have an XP Home disc, but that's a wacky upgrade scheme by M$. Just a warning to those of you with XP Pro that you can't upgrade to one of the Vista Home versions. :angry:

That is correct. XP pro is a business operating system and only Vista business and Ultimate have the same technology as pro for joining domains in a business environment (there is enterprise also but that is for 10 or more with software assurance)

Home can only upgrade to home basic Vista and premium.

Premium and ultimate have the media center built in but ultimate can do bitlocker encryption hardware and gets a few extra games.

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